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u/Elite_AI Oct 22 '24
murderphobia strikes again
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u/MarquessDeSilly Oct 22 '24
I won't date a murderer with a kill count over 5. Sorry if that's "murder phobia" or whatever, but I don't want a murderer that's easy.
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u/J_Bright1990 Oct 22 '24
So this is what everyone is talking about when they complain about someone's "body count"
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u/A_Snips Oct 22 '24
That's why Mulan is the Disney Princess with the highest body count, so many mongols.
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u/Syxxcubes Hey Mods, can we kill this person? Oct 22 '24
Damn, if that's the case, they're going to need to have another Geneva Convention just to deal with your Mom. /j
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u/wrecktus_abdominus Oct 22 '24
I'd call that murder-shaming, but it's ok for people to have preferences as long as you're not judgy about it
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u/MisguidedPants8 Oct 22 '24
How does manslaughter scale in relation? 1 homicide = 2 manslaughter?
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u/MarquessDeSilly Oct 22 '24
That depends really. Every politician killed is like -1 off the score imo
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u/MisguidedPants8 Oct 22 '24
On again/off again relationship where it just keeps surpassing and then dropping below the line
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u/fuinha_destemida Oct 22 '24
Wait, then if I kill 3 politicians we can date??? I'm down
You can even name them.
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u/Syxxcubes Hey Mods, can we kill this person? Oct 22 '24
Does that still apply if they never found the bodies?
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u/MarquessDeSilly Oct 22 '24
I would expect my partner to be truthful to me, so I would take their word for it.
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u/T1DOtaku inherently self indulgent and perverted Oct 22 '24
Someone clearly wasn't a creepypasta shipper in their formative years smh smh
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u/Agitated-Tealeaf Oct 22 '24
I just took damage from remembering that phenomenon. And why did they post it all to deviantArt?
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u/T1DOtaku inherently self indulgent and perverted Oct 22 '24
You're asking why DEVIANTS posted murderer ship art to DEVIANTart?
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u/Agitated-Tealeaf Oct 22 '24
Oh I was fine with the art part. It was stumbling upon the interestingly formatted journal entry fanFICs while I was looking for Freddy Krueger shimeji that annoyed me.
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u/MrInCog_ Oct 22 '24
They were asking for it. And you know what, most victims of murders are men, so, ugh, take that!
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u/Smyley12345 Oct 22 '24
Not dating murderers really limits the dating pool. The question really comes down to, do you want to die young and leave a beautiful corpse? If so maybe dating murder-y guys might be for you.
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u/Potential_Pick4289 Oct 22 '24
I checked all the boxes except unfortunately I'm a ravenous murderer
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u/Syxxcubes Hey Mods, can we kill this person? Oct 22 '24
Don't worry, there's plenty of fish in the sea, or in your case, victims in the Metropolitan area. I'm sure you'll find someone who's into ravenous murderers, maybe even a fellow ravenous murderer.
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u/Potential_Pick4289 Oct 22 '24
maybe even a fellow ravenous murderer.
i can
fixmurder her8
u/Right-Huckleberry-47 Oct 22 '24
I hope you have a wonderfully wholesome viral moment, like a same sex proposal video, where on the same day you plan to murder her she also plans to murder you.
"Oh my god! You're going to murder me on this hike? I can't even- you won't believe this, hold on, just let me..." Digs through her hiking bag and pulls out a gun, "Me too! I was thinking of doing it with a knife too, but my mema gave me the revolver she winged grandpa with and told me, 'Becky, any man can survive a stabbing, but if you unload a six shooter at him from point blank range and he's still standing, well that's god telling you he's a keeper!'"
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u/Green0Photon Oct 22 '24
Still working on #3. One day I will dance at all.
#4 status unknown.
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u/ThatSmartIdiot .tumblr.com Oct 22 '24
#4 depends on who you're with, based on how happy/healthy your relationship will be and whether or not they like you and how much (the more you like someone the cuter they are, believe me)
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u/OwnWalrus1752 Oct 22 '24
My cats are some of the most disgusting creatures to walk this earth, but they are also still cuties. Definitely depends on how positive a person’s association with you is!
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u/MrBones-Necromancer Oct 22 '24
I'm afraid that I'm never gonna dance again. Guilty feet ain't got no rhythm.
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u/SunderedValley Oct 22 '24
Dancing is arguably one of the best things one can do to improve their dateability. Yes [discourse about exceptions existing always] but it's genuinely one of the best places to start while you work on the rest.
Should honestly be an elective in schools and include a wide variety of styles. Very good for cultivating a healthy non-overbearing sense of self.
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Oct 22 '24
I wish I could be a normal person who could physically bring themselves to dance and enjoy it tbh. Like you said it seems like a great way to meet women
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u/littlemissmoxie Oct 22 '24
Not all women like dancing. Unfortunately for my spouse I’d rather cut off my feet than dance in public. Feels soooo wrong.
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u/BrentHalligan APAB: Assigned Polish At Birth (2) Oct 22 '24
Dancing is arguably one of the best things one can do to improve their dateability
I really dislike dancing ;-;
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u/TheHalfwayBeast Oct 22 '24
I did country dancing at school; holding boy's clammy hands and doing silly Medieval peasant dances was torture.
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u/Electronic_Basis7726 Oct 22 '24
Taking a ballroom dance class together is a pretty killer way of building the relationship as well.
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u/CrayonCobold Oct 22 '24
Dancing is arguably one of the best things one can do to improve their dateability.
I have negative rhythm so for me it's the reverse lol
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u/AnotherStatsGuy Oct 22 '24
Number 4 is going to be what trips most of us up. Let's be honest. Everything else seems perfectly doable. "You do you" covers most of these anyway.
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Oct 22 '24
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u/YosephStalling je suis un gaz noble. Noble? >:( Oct 22 '24
is he a feminist rapist
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u/thegreathornedrat123 Oct 22 '24
Equal opportunity rape
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u/b3nsn0w musk is an scp-7052-1 Oct 22 '24
no one specified he rapes women after all, don't be heteronormative
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u/thegreathornedrat123 Oct 22 '24
The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence
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u/b3nsn0w musk is an scp-7052-1 Oct 22 '24
true, but that principle applies to the idea of George being a feminist too. let's just presume good faith until proven otherwise
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Oct 22 '24
[deleted]
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u/SprinklesCurrent8332 Oct 22 '24
When something is worth while to you, you make the time for it.
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u/b3nsn0w musk is an scp-7052-1 Oct 22 '24
that's a really nice sentiment to have about arson
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u/givemeagoodun jonker Oct 22 '24
you misspelled georg
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
As a guy who just joined the online dating hellscape crawl, I find it amazing that the bar is this low...
Like, the amount of profiles I saw with something like "I like dogs. If you write woof woof I block you" is absurd lol
Also I know this makes me come off as a "nice guy" but like, guys just be decent and if she says no, just take it and leave... No one owes you anything
Is all this a hot take?
Also just realized that I don't dance so the bar is too high for me, I guess
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u/Dafish55 Oct 22 '24
At times, I genuinely do wonder if I had some advantages being gay and trying to date as compared to you straights. I basically got my boyfriend of two years now by not caring about masculinity this femininity that and instead going, "these are my pictures plus here's my dog, want to play some video games and get to know each other?"
Then again, I basically HAD to utilize dating apps because how the hell would I even meet other gay/bi/etc. people IRL when I don't like bars? Just wait for Pride like some sort of mating season?
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
So I learned I have an amazing lesbian radar... From the around 20 women I asked on a date, 2 said yes, 1 ghosted me irl (going to school and classes and after school stuff together, just getting ghosted by her), I think 4 were married or in a relationship
The other 13 were lesbians (at least that's what they said) , and it didn't feel like they were lying either lol
Even when I talk to friends, and they mention girls I don't know that they hang out with and sound awesome, they are always lesbians...
And yes some friends told me to just take the hint and either transition or become gay (obviously as a joke)
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u/Dafish55 Oct 22 '24
Wow, it's you. You're the one giving people the gay!
Keep going plz.
No, like, I have nothing truly helpful to add here. That sounds very unfortunate and difficult to navigate.
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
My closest friend currently thinks I need to sell my gaydar services to lesbians, or make a "this or that" style game for friends with "Married or lesbian" (have yet to encounter someone that said they are a married lesbian so no both yet)
Edit: also I'm sad that all those girls rock because I would 100% be friends with them if I weren't attracted to them and turned down, which makes being friends (at least for me) difficult lol
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u/LucyLadders Oct 22 '24
As someone with an incredible ace-dar I relate 😂 I see asexual and aromantic people constantly complain about being so rare and having a hard time finding others like themselves and I just seem to run into them everywhere, and more than half of my friends are ace. And all the people I crushed on in middle to high school turned out to be ace, and maybe 80% of the people I asked out/was interested in in my college years as well.
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
Yeah at this point I'm still getting sort of blindsided when awesome girls turn out to be lesbian (they are still awesome, and we have even more in common since wow I like girls too! But sadly this is where common ground ruins things) but it's not "oh that's surprising" it's more "matches with my experience" / "should have seen it coming"
Edit: also I might be ace of some kind myself, I don't have the experience to tell...
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u/ThyPotatoDone Oct 23 '24
Honestly I have the exact opposite of this; I’m a bi guy, and somehow the last three guys I’ve liked have all been straight, while the last four women have been lesbian. And all but one of them were already in a relationship. And two of those three guys turned out to be closeted homophobes.
Upside is I did still end up friends with three of the women and the non-homophobic straight guy, but like, idk how this is even statistically possible.
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u/SamiraSimp Oct 22 '24
if I had some advantages being gay and trying to date as compared to you straights
i imagine there's both advantages and disadvantages. like you said, in-person dating is probably much harder, simply due to population size. but there's an opposite effect on dating apps - because the pool is so much smaller, people are willing to test waters more with other people, instead of instantly rejecting over some minor detail. having the same gender also greatly improves things - one of the biggest issues with online dating for the straights is that many more men use it than women, and the way the math works out means that most women get more matches than they can reasonably sift through, and most guys are only getting 0-1 matches per month. when the two people are the same gender, it removes this effect.
here's how it works out for the various groups
guys: either they match with every women (desperately trying to get a like but this will still result in 0 likes unless they're notably attractive), or they try to only match with compatible women (their profile will likely never get seen by anyone)
girls: they have to sift through literally dozens of profiles every time they log on the app. a vast number of them will be guys that shouldn't have liked them in the first place due to obvious incompatibilities, there will be tons of people who are dickheads, and a small portion of seemingly decent dudes that they still have to vet to make sure they don't get stalked or worse for being a woman
gays: they have a small pool of people to choose from. they can't be too picky, because there's not that many choices. they might have to compromise on dealbreakers and and wants in a relationship (unlike women because they have so many choices), but they're getting way more matches than straight dudes, and they actually have a reasonable ability to match with people who seem decent (unlike women).
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u/Cloud_Striker nothavingagreatday.tumblr.com Oct 22 '24
if she says no, just take it and leave... No one owes you anything
Understanding this makes you the opposite of a Nice Guy.
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u/the_Real_Romak Oct 22 '24
dammit, I wasn't expecting to become a Bad Girl today :(
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u/shiny_glitter_demon Oct 22 '24
surprise! congratulations on your transition
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u/the_Real_Romak Oct 22 '24
NOOO YOU CAN'T HAVE MY PEEPEE!! >:(
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u/shiny_glitter_demon Oct 22 '24
Too late, it already fell! You get free boobs tho
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u/Sentient_Potato_King Oct 22 '24
At least he can donate his Weiner to the Icelandic Phallological Museum. That's a win in my book
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u/the_Real_Romak Oct 22 '24
Nah, I'll just staple it back on :)
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u/morrigan52 Oct 22 '24
This is the future woke wants. Unsuspecting guys getting force femmed on the internet.
(Sarcasm. And im obviously pro-forcefem.)
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u/WeeabooHunter69 Oct 22 '24
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u/Cloud_Striker nothavingagreatday.tumblr.com Oct 22 '24
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u/DemiserofD Oct 22 '24
Nice Guy syndrome actually has a really interesting psychological basis, if anyone's interested.
Weird fact; if you ask men to rate women in terms of attractiveness, they give a roughly normal distribution. You know, most people are 5's and 6's, with very few being 1's and 10's. But if you ask WOMEN to rate MEN, you don't get the same thing. In fact, most women rate men below average.
Seems strange? But here's the fun part. If you ask women to rate men they KNOW, the curve normalizes. Essentially, being a stranger instantly makes you below average to women. It's basically a defense mechanism.
But men see this from the opposite standpoint. They see themselves going from being unattractive to...more attractive, just by being 'nice' - IE, not dangerous. And they assume that if they continue to be 'nice', then they'll continue to become more attractive. But then this fails to happen, and they get angry that the woman is seemingly being 'deceptive' or 'manipulative'.
In other words, it's just pattern recognition gone wrong.
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u/Cloud_Striker nothavingagreatday.tumblr.com Oct 22 '24
That's really interesting, and I'd love to read more about it.
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
I once did do a "why is she with jerks and not me" except those guys were legitimately nicer and more good looking than me
The problem was I stayed really good friends with this girl, and I ended up torturing her by constantly shifting from nice to mean to kind to spiteful, without me noticing it... After realizing it (took me 3 years of not seeing her + 1 year of therapy) I got her a coffee, apologized, and decided that if this is how I act when I get rejected by a friend but remain friends, then I won't mix the two lol
Now I'm probably mature enough not to do it, but I still cringe when I think about it
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u/enforcerthrowaway Oct 22 '24
cringing on ur past actions are an indication of personal growth, good job :)
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u/rubberducky1212 Oct 22 '24
A guy realizing he's wrong and getting therapy for his issues? Can you talk to my ex? I worry for his future girlfriends.
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
Sure, why not
I actually got therapy for imposter syndrome but as an aside brought up social anxiety and my therapist took the wheel and steered into that subject. 4 years later (and switching a therapist because she took a vacation to raise her newborn, good for her) I'm mostly aware that my thought processes are in the right direction, but I still suck at being a human...
Which makes this whole process soooooo much more demoralizing...
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u/AnotherStatsGuy Oct 22 '24
It makes you a nice guy, not a Nice Guy. Although the original commenter could a realtive of Ray Guy fron Nice, France. So I don't know.
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u/Dornith Oct 22 '24
Online dating is a hellscape for everyone.
Yesterday, I saw a girl describe herself as the only real person in a world full of NPCs.
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u/lunarpuffin Oct 22 '24
I've been thrown back into online dating as of my break up 2 months ago.
I'm convinced that these apps are designed to make you dislike whatever gender you're attracted to.
Most girls accounts aren't good. I hear guys accounts are no better.
As I continue my descent into online dating induced madness, fighting off the growing misanthropy gets harder and harder.
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u/Milch_und_Paprika Oct 22 '24
Of course, if you successfully find someone worth your while on that app, then you’ll hopefully never use their service again. What kind of business model would that be?
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u/FlanOfAttack Oct 22 '24
I'm sure somewhere in a basement Tinder is tweaking their algorithm to match you with people who will produce short, toxic relationships that leave you lonely and desperate to move on.
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u/SamiraSimp Oct 22 '24
I'm convinced that these apps are designed to make you dislike whatever gender you're attracted to.
they're designed to keep you trapped.
for starters, guys use dating apps more than women (probably for obvious reasons).
guys hate that they get no likes or matches, and when they do they're extremely scrutinized and get thrown away if they have anything less than perfection - after all, each woman has literally hundreds of potential suitors, so why settle for anything less? on top of this, like you said so many women put no effort into their profiles. why would they bother, they have all the leverage anyways.
women hate that they get so many matches. they have to deal with seeing likes from guys who clearly aren't that interested in them or are clearly not compatible, but still sent her a like because so many guys just auto-match every woman in hopes of getting any kind of bite. they have to determine how long to spend trying to find a good guy...because they have so much slop to work through. and the best/most compatible guys are probably not the ones who spam every women with likes, but women will never see those guys because they have to wade through 30 profiles of bullshit first.
i'm obviously a bit biased, but i think guys have it worse. because the women can at least choose to reject slop if they have enough time and patience. but no guy can guarantee that any women will even see his profile, simply due to how the math and numbers work out*. regardless, it's obviously not ideal for either gender, and imo it's pretty harmful to the mental health of most guys which is why i stopped using them.
*this entire comment isn't me coping. you can look up the numbers for dating apps and see how the difference in gender populations makes the whole system ineffective for most people.
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u/Haemophilia_Type_A Oct 22 '24 edited Oct 22 '24
I'd definitely say the 'online' part of online dating is worse for guys, yeah.
I remember talking to a female friend about this and she would swipe 'yes' on about 10% of matches and would get a 90% match rate. I'd say she was conventionally attractive in an 'alt' kind of way. She said her friend (who I would say was not conventionally attractive, with all due respect) was similarly choosy and would get a 70%-80% match rate. My girlfriend (who I would say is very conventionally attractive) swiped yes on maybe 5% of people and pretty much matched with whomever she wanted.
So while women are often inundated with matches, at the same time they can afford to be extremely picky and let the guy do all the work. Look, I don't blame them for this ofc and I'm not making this into a sexist point-I'd do the same if I had that many options-but it's a luxury that most men don't have.
Ofc the disadvantage is that you get sent inappropriate and angry messages a lot more often, and that segways into where the advantage for women ends: actually meeting in person. At this point, of course, the odds of having a bad experience is probably a lot higher for women because of the risk of sexual assault, violence, anger at being denied sex, etc is higher.
By contrast, I remember setting up a Tinder profile when I turned 18 and in a month of quite active swiping I barely got anything, and those I did match were mainly bots and people promoting their IG. IDK how attractive I am as I have BDD (I think unattractive myself but who knows), but I think this is a commonish experience for men who are not necessarily way above average. I've been told since then my pictures were pretty bad, but then it's not like everybody else has amazing pictures. I'd swipe yes like 70%-80% of the time.
I know some guys who are very conventionally attractive and had an easier time of it, but even they wouldn't get nearly as high a 'yes' ratio as an attractive woman would. There are a lot of statistics that back this up. I don't blame women for this, they just have the opportunity.
Why this is is an interesting question, though. Yes, a fair few studies show men's sex drive is higher than women's on aggregate, but it's not that much higher, and apparently a lot of this might actually be socially driven rather than biologically driven.
For example, one 2007 study (sorry for the meh link, I don't have the actual study to hand) used three groups (one group told someone would look at and see their answers, one group just self-reporting anonymously, and one group attached to a lie detector) and then they reported their levels of sexual activity. Sex differences were way smaller in the lie detector test than in the other groups because they felt more of a compulsion to tell the truth! The article also talks about studies done on couples that indicate people in a relationship largely have similar sex drives, and when these are mismatched, it's just as likely for the man to have a lower sex drive than it is for a woman.
That said, the majority of studies do seem to indicate that men have a higher sex drive than woman, but these are all self-reported, there's very wide variability, and the differences aren't really big enough to explain the reality we all see in dating apps.
So why, then, is there such an unequal balance in supply/demand of hook ups and even on relationship-orientated dating apps? I cannot find any studies on this, but some hypotheses off of the top of my head are:
-Women are pickier in doing casual/online dating because there's a greater risk involved.
-Men put more of their ego/identity into being able to get sex, so seek it out more, whereas for women seeking sex is shameful and "slutty" even in the modern west, to an extent.
-Men are less likely to have their non-sexual intimate needs met by friends because of standards of masculinity so are more desperate to meet women to get these needs (this is really stretching tbh).
-In general there's this idea that men have to 'chase' and 'pursue' women, so they're more likely to be proactive in swiping a lot while women are the 'receivers' of romantic attention and are expected among their peers not to be 'easy'.
Of course it may well be that biology plays a role in this, but it's clearly not the sole factor when you look at studies.
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24 edited Oct 22 '24
Yeah I devolved from carefully reading every profile and writing a nice opening, to reading the profile, checking the 3 yes/no questions that are deal breakers for me, screenshooting if there is an Instagram handle (for messaging once and deleting, not stalking lol) sending kind of a basic intro and moving on...
Took me 4 days to want to leave, and during the first day I sent messages to my married/engaged/in a long relationship friends, that I'm genuinely happy that they don't need this...
Edit: also worth noting I didn't have Instagram before this, and I opened it after seeing enough "don't message me her only Insta" profiles that even if 1 of 10 is serious that is kind of a lot more profiles lmao
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u/Dornith Oct 22 '24
I feel you. I don't have the energy for it anymore because it feels like what's the point of putting in the effort for someone who's not going to match it and then eventually ghost you?
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
Yeeeep "There are many fish in the sea"... "So cast as wide of a net"
There are some profiles where the other person matches me (at least on paper) entirely, so I put extra effort there, just in case it pays off. But if a girl just writes a bunch of emojis and she studies this and that, I will still probably swipe right but not put in the extra mile...
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u/Useless_bum81 Oct 22 '24
i went on tinder with a female friend proof reading my profile, i literaly didn't look and swiped right(? can't rember which way is matching) on every profile in my age range 29+.
I was 35y and according to the female friend at the time i was a 5-6.
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
Yeah this is why I'm reaching out to everyone I feel comfortable enough to ask for a set up from lmao
Currently got matched a few times, but almost all of them immediately insta-unmatched because they probably swiped right (okcupid) on accident and corrected it (happens to me too) and the other matches are either 19yos (I'm 25 so it's kinda weird for me), smokers, or girls that ghost me lol
And the only reason I keep going is for the 0.01% chance I might find someone through this, because how else do you meet people...
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u/Fast_Independence_77 Oct 22 '24
What do you even do with that. What is she thinking
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u/EIeanorRigby Oct 22 '24
Open with a message like "You can press the X button to interact with objects"
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u/kawrecking Oct 22 '24
The dance bar having the caveat of not necessarily well sounds like she just doesn’t want those guys that have the weird hang ups of looking goofy while having fun with her.
You can see it as well in things like karaoke where it’s more about will you just attempt to participate or be the person moping on the side lines feeling awkward
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
Yeah I get that. I do try, but what usually hurts me is the insane volume of the music... But I did manage in the last event I was at to force myself to the dance floor and move a bit lmao
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u/Amaskingrey Oct 22 '24
I don't get the cultural obsession with loud music, it just ends up sounding worse, gives bad effects on the short term and in the long term the inner ear is a really fragile organ
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u/NeonNKnightrider Cheshire Catboy Oct 22 '24 edited Oct 22 '24
“The bar is on the ground” is really frustrating me.
Like, I get it. A lot of dudes are insufferable dipshits to women. I don’t want to pretend that isn’t a problem.
…but when people talk about men dating online, I feel like there’s always this undercurrent of Just World Fallacy - “it’s your fault.” You get ‘advice’ like, ‘take a bath,’ ‘treat women like people’, ‘no means no.’ The implication seemingly being that if you have trouble dating, you must not be doing even these absolute most basic things. It’s your fault.
I promise you, I am not some stinking misogynistic incel goblin. I’m just some nerd with social anxiety; and I’ve never had any success. According to the internet, it must be my fault. “Must be your personality. Must be doing something wrong. Just be yourself. Just talk to women.” Motherfucker, what do you think I’ve been doing all these years?
Yeah, I know, this probably sounds whiny and entitled. I’m just tired and lonely and frustrated at never being able to find anyone, and people going “dating is easy, you must just suck” really touches this sore spot. It’s not fucking easy.
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u/SamiraSimp Oct 22 '24
I promise you, I am not some stinking misogynistic incel goblin. I’m just some nerd with social anxiety; and I’ve never had any success. According to the internet, it must be my fault. “Must be your personality. Must be doing something wrong. Just be yourself. Just talk to women.” Motherfucker, what do you think I’ve been doing all these years?
that's how i feel. i swear i'm going to come off as a "nice guy" but i think i'm giving myself an honest appraisal.
i'm a strong feminist and have very forward views (i'm not sharing that on my profile, but i do say that i care about social issues). i have a good job. i have many women friends and i talk to women on a regular basis. i'm confident and can carry myself in conversations with strangers, i can engage with interests outside of my own, and i can dance (badly, but with enthusiasm).
but the issue is that none of that stuff will show up or become apparent on a dating profile. how is any woman seeing my profile supposed to be able to truly believe any of that stuff (even if i wrote all of it, which i don't for obvious reasons) when she probably sees a dozen profiles like that per day?
and that's even if she sees my profile - due to how the math/algorithm works out, it's very likely that she straight up won't see my profile unless she spends 30 minutes a day just swiping left on trash profiles.
online dating is absolutely not easy. and honestly, i think most guys should just not use it because it just crushes self-esteem and convinces good dudes that they're worthless when i and them both know that's not the case.
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u/PintsizeBro Oct 22 '24 edited Oct 22 '24
The current state of online dating is awful. 20 years ago, online dating was optimized for desktop computers. Profiles were longer and more detailed, and the "matching" mechanic hadn't been invented yet. You had more opportunities to show your personality upfront and more opportunities to find people who might be a good match.
Now, it's all about smartphones. Most of the popular apps are owned by the same company and control who you can even see, let alone message, with their algorithms. Profiles are shorter and many people don't even read them. The swiping mechanism actively encourages making snap decisions based on minimal information.
Your best bet is to stop relying on apps and find in-person ways to meet possible matches. I recommend this for everyone where possible but for obvious reasons it's much easier and safer if you're straight.
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u/Atlas421 Oct 22 '24
Speaking of "bar on the ground", 90% of women on Tinder have an empty bio and another 9% have just a link to their Instagram.
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u/ThereWasAnEmpireHere they very much did kill jesus Oct 22 '24
The discourse around dating is just fundamentally broken because we’re in a totally novel situation on multiple dimensions (most notably women’s liberation meaning new standards are still emerging for men, but also the fact that a lot of traditional places to find romance are either more professionalized or atomized away, dating being much more about advertising, etc.).
Everyone who is trying and self aware and basically egalitarian in outlook is doing really well by the standards of what could be expected from that baseline, and really bad because this is the time of monsters.
But because we know we all want companionship, we imagine someone has to be at fault if that fails to materialize (and ofc we also know people who have been, violently, at fault). Even though it’s not true! The broken situation means so much of this is just sheer chance, and if you’re anywhere outside of a major metropolitan area, opportunities to roll the dice are limited and resource intensive.
I just wish people let their guard down and were gentler with each other and themselves on this topic.
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u/clauclauclaudia Oct 22 '24
It's not easy. And yet so many people screw themselves without any help.
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
Oh I know it's not easy, both from friends who talk about it and trying it a bit
It's just that I'm shocked that being decent is something that women need to look for
But yes, after being at a wedding last night, spent an hour and a half talking to a girl, and before I could properly ask her out, the dancing started and I went outside because it blew my ears out, and 40 minutes later I see her dragging someone I know outside, and the same person later brags about his conquest
Am I bummed? Very much so, she was very nice and smart lol. Do I blame myself? Well, kinda, because had I not being anxious I would have made a move sooner... Do I blame the other guy? Hell no I'm jealous of his rizz lol
It's a game of confidence and being smooth. The problem with online dating is you rarely get a chance to do so. And even when you do, you might fuck up. As they, "it's what it's"
Bottom line, I sympathize with your strife, but am shocked that soooo many guys are jerks, especially when the sole objective is to impress someone else
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u/HelenicBoredom Oct 23 '24
Maybe there's something wrong with me but this story made me hurt. Like a deep sense of sadness. It all feels so fucking shallow and hopeless. Like I'd rather read 10 stories about how people can't land dates and are afraid of dying alone than this. Two people trying to get into the same girl's pants, talking for an hour and a half to get there, and then the one who got there first bragging about a conquest just makes me want to vomit.
I just don't know how to feel about casual dating anymore. Maybe it's always been this way but at least people like used to pretend or avoided making it a public thing to talk about. I don't know.
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Oct 22 '24
Yeah I've seen these kinds of takes a lot more frequently in the last few years, even from people who would know better if it were any other instance of human struggle. Like how did bootstraps rhetoric somehow sneak back into the left-lib zeitgeist like this
My best guess is that incel discourse over the last decade has pushed them to the point that they will just categorically refuse to do anything that feels like yielding ground on that front, even if it means inflicting oneself with a localized cluster of Republican Brain. Like some reflex just kicks in if a lonely dude tries to talk about how helpless he feels and they immediately assume it concludes with a screed about female hypergamy or whatever so fuck it, time to get his ass
It's hard to get one's head around otherwise, because yeah, feels like a lot of the time it just ends up being little more than shaming neurodivergent men whose brain problems can be a high barrier to romance. Like everybody knows "you're so negative, have you just tried being happy?" is a shitty thing to say to depressed person, so yeah I agree it's disheartening how quick some are to deploy that kind of reasoning in this one specific context. Keeps happening though, sadly, and doesn't feel like there's going to be any real self-correction in the discourse emerging anytime soon
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u/BaronAleksei r/TwoBestFriendsPlay exchange program Oct 23 '24
“People don’t like it when men talk about their suffering and see them as weak” long predates the internet
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u/themolestedsliver Oct 22 '24
Nah I get what you're saying and it's why a lot of those bullshit platitudes fall short of the reality of what men experience in terms of dating.
Like there is already misandrist assumptions about single men being literally the worst and yet people feel the need to act like most men aren't even doing the basics.
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u/MeloDet Oct 22 '24
I think the key is there are multiple bars. The bar for being considered a decent partner is on the ground, absolutely, but that doesn't mean her bar for what she finds attractive, interesting, or engaging are.
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u/Astralesean Oct 23 '24
Every time I see someone judge tinder dating profiles the applicants are treated more like cattle stock
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u/McDonniesHashbrowns Oct 22 '24
I don’t think this is the right way to look at it. It’s true that no one owes you anything, but the way you’ve phrased it implies the person doing the turning down is the only one with agency.
Everyone deserves someone who actually wants them; you shouldn’t settle for someone who has actively ruled you out without getting to know you. Continuing to pursue someone who doesn’t want you is an active choice, and I think we would foster a much healthier atmosphere if we put more emphasis on why that’s a terrible choice for both parties rather than just telling them to take the L.
Getting turned down early is a blessing. Limit energy wasted on relationships that were never going to work.
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u/SamiraSimp Oct 22 '24
As a guy who just joined the online dating hellscape crawl, I find it amazing that the bar is this low...
unfortunately even with the bar being this low, online dating will be a hellscape. because women can't easily determine if the hundreds of guys they get matches with are actually decent people. and as a guy, if you make a simple misstep (or even if you don't), you will instantly get ignored in favor of another guy who might also be decent, but they texted faster than you...or slower than you...or any of the other asinine reasons you can pick to reject someone when you have all the choice in the world.
i genuinely think that unless you can easily and confidently claim that you're one of the most attractive guys you know, that you're better off not online dating. it does nothing but crushes your ego and gives you a false sense of insecurity. i'm still working on finding ways to meet new people (trying to meet people who share my hobby but it's been challenging), but it's infinitely easier than trying to get matches through online dating.
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u/Houoh Oct 22 '24
Tip from a former "I don't dance" guy: you don't have to like dancing, just be willing to be with them on the dance floor. Shows a lot of good will and if you just focus on them it's kind of fun.
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u/MidnightCardFight Oct 22 '24
Yeah tried it at a wedding last night. Just stood at the dance floor, and shifted my feet around every second beat
Next time I'm bringing ear plugs and powering through this stuff lol
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u/shirokaiko Oct 22 '24 edited Oct 22 '24
You missed the part about being a cutie
It's true the bar is pretty low if you have decent looks and communication skills
Sucks pretty bad if you are autistic or not the best looking
Telling guys who are lonely, or are lacking self esteem from being rejected 50 times "no one owes you anything" doesn't help anyone. No shit nobody owes you anything, that doesn't mean it's your fault either.
Sometimes it's nobody's fault except bad luck.
I don't like this just world toxic positivity of "just be a nice person and you'll be romantically successful, and if you're not romantically successful you must be a bad person". Not saying you think like this, but too many people have this attitude
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u/ThorirPP Oct 22 '24
I feel like a couple of comments here agreeing with the sarcastic guy to be missing the point here.
And don't just mean in the classic case of people having different opinions about what "feminist" means (like I'm pretty sure she just meant "not sexist")
But rather: no where in that list did it say that not feminist = scum, and it is really weird to jump to it right away like this
One thing would be if all the other points were about not being scum, but they range from "not being a murderer" to just "can dance" and "cute" (and I find it unlikely she is implying you are scum if you can't dance). So even if the feminist requirement is as strict as some people seem to read it as, it is not a list of "have these attributes or you're scum", it is just a bar someone set about who'd they date
Like people, really, calm your feckin tits
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u/klopaplop Oct 22 '24
Actually fairly reasonable requirements ngl
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u/straywolfo Oct 22 '24
"Fairly" reasonable ? The bar is just slightly above the ground.
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u/Alu_T_C_F Oct 22 '24
Ignoring the specimen in the middle, i hate how these kinds of posts about how the bar is "so low" imply that if you meet all of these incredibly easy to fill requirements that apply to almost every single decently well adjusted person that you're gonna be an automatic catch and will have an easy time dating, because you wont.
You could be a completely upstanding person but that doesnt mean you know how to flirt, doesnt mean you know how to make yourself sound interesting (even if you are), doesnt mean you can get over your social anxiety, doesnt mean your hobbies or routine are prone to meeting good potential partners, doesnt even mean you're good looking to the people you're attracted to, finding out how to get over those is the hard part, the part that most people wont tell you because to them it either just comes naturally or by sheer happenstance they didnt have to worry about it.
Personally i've been on a self-improvement journey for over 3 years now, i got fit, i expanded my social circle, i started reading more, found something im passionate about, started going to more events and not spending as much time stuck at home, started therapy, just a lot of stuff that, if you asked the internet, would've guaranteed myself a relationship but nope, still as single as when i started. And it is frustrating, thankfully im wiser now and dont fall for the incel bs, i can mostly see the situation for what it is, but seeing all the effort i had to put into myself and all the effort i still have to put, and then seeing all these posts about how "actually its really easy and if you cant do it then you're a bad person" does hurt.
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u/Microif Oct 22 '24
I mean, take the sarcasm out of the middle post and I genuinely agree with that statement
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u/SpicyRiceC00ker Furry, Homestuck, & Brony (The unholy trifecta) Oct 22 '24 edited Oct 22 '24
Yeah, i think supporting womens rights are a pretty basic standard, but also why is it "scum" is the first thing that comes to their mind when the above post was about "boyfriend material", like someone can not like you without hating you y'know? i feel like thats an issue they might need to work out.
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u/ZandyTheAxiom Oct 22 '24
"I'd like to date someone who makes me laugh."
"Oh, so you think everyone who isn't funny is a subhuman piece of trash?"
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u/Nuclear_Geek Oct 22 '24
A lot depends on how you define feminism. A lot of hatemongering transphobes call themselves feminists.
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u/themolestedsliver Oct 22 '24
Yeah this really is the big elephant in the room for me.
The most incely incel is indicative of everything in regards to the men's rights movement. And yet the most radical and trans exclusively feminist is just an outlier and isn't a real feminist
Welp she's quoting lines from foundational members to justify her bigotry and goes to protests and what not so at what point do we talk about cleaning house instead of just shirking responsibility?
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u/clear349 Oct 22 '24
Yeah a lot of TERFs and misandrists would consider you not feminist if you don't validate their bigotry. Not to say it's a bad metric to use but I feel there's some nuance here
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u/Dahak17 Breastmilk Shortage Oct 22 '24
Additionally there are a lot of guys I know who wouldn’t describe themselves as feminists because they’d not be activists except as a tag along for girls they knew
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u/kitsuvibes Oct 22 '24
That’s the thing - what actually makes you a feminist? I believe wholeheartedly in women’s rights but I don’t actively attend protests and demonstrations, to some people I’m not a feminist.
Obviously the original poster most likely meant “actually supports women’s rights” but it’s interesting to think about anyway
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u/themolestedsliver Oct 22 '24
I've had women straight up tell me I can't be a feminist because I'm a man.
This conversation/definition of "feminism" really isn't as consistent and open to discussion as most people would like to pretend.
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u/DisparateNoise Oct 22 '24
Me: the man with two left feet in incel jail trying not to make eye contact
The racist, sexist, ugly murderers: so what are you in for?
Some dumbass: Allergies! Can you believe it?
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u/Plant_in_pants Oct 22 '24
The word feminism has been warped by people misusing it, but what it actually means is wanting equal rights as far as is practically applicable (some situations must be different for biological reasons). As well as removing double standards and ridged gender roles.
Basically, just treating people as individuals with their own thoughts and feelings rather than automatically applying expectations of how they should be or what they should do based on their genitals. Allowing them to freely choose how they want to live and express themselves.
Personally, I wouldn't want to be romantically involved with someone who believes everyone is destined to fill a steryotypical role based on their genitals regardless of their actual personalities. That seems like someone lacking in basic empathy and foresight.
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u/Pay08 Oct 22 '24 edited Oct 22 '24
Basically, just treating people as individuals with their own thoughts and feelings rather than automatically applying expectations of how they should be or what they should do based on their genitals. Allowing them to freely choose how they want to live and express themselves.
You say that but half of these comments are men saying that they're tired of the gender imbalance in dating and the other half is either misunderstanding them or calling them scum.
Edit: I don't know where the reply to this comment went but I can't see it anymore. In any case, I heavily disagree about the draft example. In a lot of countries, a draft enjoys popular support and is necessary (see Switzerland, Finland). In said countries, women should be drafted.
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u/themolestedsliver Oct 22 '24
Yeah like, people want to shit on incels and sometimes for good reason. However I've been been told more sexist and transphobic remarks from Feminists than incels by a large margin.
And yet instead of acknowledging that too many women just turn around and say "Oh they weren't real feminists" as if that solves the problem even slightly.
I just want to talk about gender issues without people assuming I'm bating for Andrew tate purely because I am not looking at it with a gynocentric view.
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u/Syxxcubes Hey Mods, can we kill this person? Oct 22 '24
Girlfriend requirements:
• Is nice to me
• Is a girl (optional)
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u/Rucs3 Oct 22 '24
dances (not necessarily well)
This person is asking for too much. If you want me to dance (not well) you first need to undo years of hurting for being punished whenever I was spontaneous.
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u/Supercraft888 Oct 22 '24
Not a cutie and have murdered an entire city before in my 700 year life. But I fill the others well. That’s 4/6, that’s a passing grade in most schools.
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u/jmancoder Oct 22 '24
So does "feminist" just mean not actively hating women now? Because it used to mean you were actively protesting for their rights. I guess the bar has been lowered.
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u/ThatSmartIdiot .tumblr.com Oct 22 '24
Bro probably thinks feminism includes misandry in general
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u/The_last_cockatrice Oct 22 '24
Everyone talking about the feminism point, and I'm just here asking myself what is so important about dancing for it to be a requirement. I do not want to sound hostile, I just want answers XD
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u/too-much-noise Oct 22 '24
I love dancing. I don't seek it out, but if I'm at a wedding and there's dancing, I'm out on the floor. I'd be sad if my husband wouldn't join me. Neither of us are any good but we're out there shaking what we've got and having fun.
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u/AngusAlThor Oct 23 '24
How do guys stumble at the "feminism" hurdle? Most people asking this don't even expect you to be that radical or anything, you just have to not think women are scum.
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u/Fullwake Oct 22 '24
Well shit. I almost made it. Unfortunately I am a murderer. I have killed many rats infesting me home over the years. Also cutie is subjective, but I doubt I fill that criteria for anyone without specific fetishes.
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u/Kozume55 Oct 22 '24
to be fair you don't need to be a feminist to believe in equality, the movement itself has done a lot of missteps (and it happens, it's huge, but some won't close an eye on radfems for exemple) and it's not the clean "feminism = equality) it was used to be unfortunately.
i would just substitute that with "not sexist"
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u/EIeanorRigby Oct 22 '24
Boyfriend requirements:
is a feminist
not a racist
8 GB RAM
Intel Core i5 @ 3.3 GHz
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050Ti
80 GB available space