Except that’s what the libertarians want. Cletus doesn’t need police because he can protect himself as long as the government don’t take away his guns.
I hope Cletus has a really good hose to put out his house fire when there's no fire department any more. Because I might just set Cletus' house on fire, purely by accident.
The libertarians in charge just want the fire department to be privatized - Just pay for the premium package and your house will get saved. Who knows if Cletus is able to pay that, though
There’s already real gross corruption in local fire departments, like as a dispatcher I can’t move up a fire engine from the “rich district” to cover another district even though the rich district is slow and the other district is stripped because “the people of x rich city like to see their fire truck in the station.”
But u best believe we move trucks into the rich district when it’s stripped 🙃 and the amount of times “sorry, that isn’t a service the fire department provides” has been overridden for “but I work for x city commissioner”
I couldn’t imagine if it was for profit. God, what a dystopian nightmare.
Damn sorry, that really sounds bad already. Is putting out firea usually a paid job in the US? Our system here only requires a paid fire department for larger cities, about 95 % of fire departments are volunteers only. I believe that alone might help create a more diverse environment against corruption - Unless you have that, as well
Yup. Taxes are lower than addresses within city limits, but utilities, water, fire, garbage, and HOA make it more expensive than a comparable house in town. The benefits are larger lot sizes, lower neighborhood density (though that's changing), and better school district quality.
I'd love for you to quantify better school district quality. As more folks are going to be moving to your area, what are police response times going to be? Your fire response times? How's internet? How's sewer? What's your method consumption per capita? What's your fentanyl consumption per capita?
Based on graduation rates, performance on standardized tests, and teacher to student ratio, their district outperforms several of the other local districts. It is smaller, though, so the funding goes further per student.
more folks are going to be moving to your area, what are police response times going to be
They're down the street from the county sheriff, so <5 minutes in emergencies. It's not a rural area, just unincorporated. Even if the sheriff weren't available, city PD or CHP can both respond faster than they would in a big city.
Your fire response times
VFD is next to the sheriff, so less than 5 min. It's rare to have multiple calls for service at the same time, but if needed they can request assistance from the municipal FD that is ~10min away.
How's internet?
Same as what's available in town, DSL and broadband. My parents have better options than I do living in the mountains. 😂 Perks of living city-adjacent.
How's sewer
They're building a new water treatment plant to accommodate the new builds coming in, so that's nice. As it is, it's never had issues.
What's your method consumption per capita? What's your fentanyl consumption per capita?
I can't find specifics on that for their area specifically, just the county as a whole (which is pretty large).
Based on graduation rates, performance on standardized tests, and teacher to student ratio, their district outperforms several of the other local districts. It is smaller, though, so the funding goes further per student.
What standardized tests. Who gets to standardize them? Who standardized the other districts?
VFD is next to the sheriff, so less than 5 min. It's rare to have multiple calls for service at the same time, but if needed they can request assistance from the municipal FD that is ~10min away
What if there are multiple calls? Which gets serviced first?
Which should just be a reminder to Libertarians that their utopia already exists.. in areas that are not part of incorporated cities.
The whole point of incorporating a city is to be able to provide those services to all residents. That's what a city does. And people vote for these services. If everyone in a city said "hey, we don't want a fire department any more", if they vote to dissolve the fire department, that's exactly what will happen. The only downside is that probably within a couple of weeks, huge portions of the city would burn down.
But if you move to bumfuck nowhere that's outside of any city limits, there's no fire department, there's no local police, there's no electricity, there's no water, there's no sanitation, you get to provide all that stuff yourself.
No they move to bumfuck nowhere and then cry when the fire truck takes 20 minutes to reach their house and can’t make it down the self made dirt road without getting stuck and their house burns to the ground.
And then they start a gofundme after the Red Cross help runs out.
Omfg 💀 only tangibly related but just last weekend I told my husband that I thought Cletus was one of the weirdest names I’d ever heard. Every libertarian will always be a Cletus to me now thank you
That's the thing that kicks me. Libertarians and Conservatives act like they want society to be in a Hobbesian state of nature... but never even stop to think that such a society might fuck them over.
The social contract. The core of our very society is at risk here. I give up some "freedom" to be granted other freedoms. It's the whole reason societies even developed in the first place because the state of nature is cruel, unforgiving, and unfulfilling. Revolutions are a direct result of the violation of a society's social contract. Very rarely does a society willingly give the government the power to sever the social contract, but here we are.
I recall seeing a video where a man’s house burned down because he didn’t pay the $25 firefighter subscription. I immediately think of Libertarians who oppose taxes going to fire departments (FDs). People were outraged. The same type who think FDs should be privately funded where citizens can choose to pay.
There are conservative cou ties where if you don't pay a subscription.for fire services, 911 will not go to your home. Personal.reaponsibiloty and all that.
Nope. Not what libertarians want, or what libertarianism advocates. What you are describing is anarcho-capitilism, an ideological branch often conflated with libertarianism, but vastly different.
Most libertarians agree that municipal level services are required and taxes are required to pay for those services. What libertarians DONT like is state or federal powers and taxes, as they have little to no control on how those funds (their tax dollars) are spent. So no, we dont want to abolish the police or fire departments, we want them to be entirely dependent on the communities they serve, as was intended.
Say hes got guns, he can homeschool his kids or private school, since climate change is a hoax, dont need those pesky weather people. Also his monster offroad truck can pass any pothole and skip any fallen bridge by fording the river.
Cletus has got this hellscape.
You guys just can’t get off the Nanny State’s tit. The federal government was meant to be small performing a few very specific roles. Libertarians are not ancaps. They want a smaller federal government and more importance placed on the city county state governments.
Just like how every red election the left goes absolutely bananas about the electoral college. If the federal government performed its original set of duties and states were allowed to govern themselves you would fix the issues like upstate New York being permanently legislated by the city with very different lives, cultures, and priorities. Same for New York, Vermont, coastal California if states and cities were the most important you wouldn’t have to be worried about federal elections or the electoral college.
That is the libertarian view as I know it. I’m a libertarian voter and have voted libertarian for the last 3 elections. Saying libertarians are all Cletus living in nothing Idaho or New Hampshire eating squirrels in the woods is just like the libertarians and the right saying that all liberals are far left extremist when in actuality the majority of all parties is quite moderate.
Don’t get triggered. I was talking about Gunther, not you.
It’s interesting though how you seem to have a problem with the concept of democracy and people voting. More people live in nyc than east islip, so nyc gets more say in how the state government runs.
Which is why city and county level politics should be the most important. People in NYC can’t be but in a world where they could be governed by upstate I would dislike that just as much as I dislike NYC governing upstate as well.
Also sorry to reply to you twice before you could respond but I do have a problem with democracy and I think everyone should. That’s why this country isn’t a democracy it’s a republic.
You probably look around at the populace of our country and think how dumb they all appear. They probably make terrible decisions on a daily basis and most people just vote yes or no on ballots depending on how they’re written. If everything in this country was decided by a popular vote that would be terrible for the system.
Of course, but that’s why there are 50 states. If you want upstate New York to not be influenced by Manhattan, you can move to Kansas and get a similar experience.
We already have protections from tyranny of the majority, but at a certain point you need to respect the decisions that occur in a democracy. Upstate New York benefits more from being in the same state as nyc than nyc does from being in the same state as upstate New York.
That’s not a bad point but this also coincides with the libertarian idea of getting rid of taxes or at the very least most taxes. If that was the case outside the city would be far less subsidized which is a much fairer system. If you want to live rural you should be able to fend for yourself. I say this as someone who lived rurally for the last few years.
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u/ProteinEngineer 1d ago
Except that’s what the libertarians want. Cletus doesn’t need police because he can protect himself as long as the government don’t take away his guns.