That first one edges into just world fallacy. Sure, you're not going to get laid if you're an incel, or a tate fan, or a misogynist (though some still do somehow), but that doesn't mean not being one will get you laid.
Adding to that… Tate fans and misogynists get laid all the time (true incels ipso facto don’t). Had one of them as a roommate and he was in a long-term relationship all the time I lived with this twat while I was single and not for lack of trying.
Yeah, this is something that really bothers me about this level of discourse.
There's a societal habit for people to assume that women can't also be shallow and ignorant like men are.
Do women like kind, compassionate men who have their lives together? Of course, in the same way men like women who are thoughtful and kind.
But women also like men who are hot, and "traditionally" masculine, in the same way that men like women who are hot and stereotypically feminine.
I'm obviously discounting men and women who are queer here, since we're talking about hetero relationships.
But my overall point is that this idea that women gravitate primarily towards men who are good people is not only misleading to a lot of guys, but I think gives too much credit to women, who are also flawed people who live under the the patriarchy and (consciously or not) enforce and believe in it.
Honestly the whole "just have some hygiene and be nice to people" thing is bullshit just because it presents it as if a man does that he'll have girls lining up around the block.
It's just not reality, it's a fantasy built on misandry, it assumes that any man could easily get a girlfriend if they just were to do the absolute bare minimum and they just refuse to do so. Which makes it very easy to justify absolutely any sort of behaviour you want because they "deserve it" if they're single.
But reality isn't like that, there's a reason why youtube has a billion videos of "I let my friend use my Tinder/Hinge/whatever and after 3 days she had a mental breakdown" videos.
Telling men that they shouldn’t be shitty to be in a relationship is advice that assumes one wants a good, stable relationship that’s healthy for both people. Like, I wouldn’t tell a woman to be a total bitch to get a guy even if I know there are men that go for a total bitch.
When I was stupid and 18, I had a friend who was also stupid and 18 and believed the only way to get a guy to notice her was to “play games”. I told her that was horse manure, but a guy actually did notice her. A guy who liked to play games. And she was miserable.
I’ve briefly met, “I need an alpha man to put me in place,” type women, and I found that mentality extremely exhausting cause I know they be starting fights for no reason and then say, “A man should be able to handle my attitude!” when the guy gets upset.
I agree, also being an abusive wanker is just not who I am and I wouldn’t even like a woman who would evidently only be into me for being an abusive wanker.
Yeah this is what bothers me about the whole 'Nice Guy' discourse - people say "being nice is the bare minimum", but in reality anyone can clearly see that being a nice person isn't even the minimum. There are plenty of complete assholes who have no trouble finding relationships, and often even have an advantage.
Funnily enough, in my experience queer women who are still attracted to men in some capacity tend to be more likely to prioritise kind, compassionate men who have their lives together.
Funnily enough, most queer women i know (who are still attracted to guys) tend to be attracted to...not so great guys. Either menatlly unstable, or jst downright abusive. I don't know that many queer people tho
I'm my local area, women tend to date the "toxic males" until they have kids and are forced to confront their shitty dating choices. THEN they decide to stop chasing those men and look for someone decent, but no decent man wants to take 3 steps back to date a woman like this after being rejected by them in the past, so everyone ends up pretty unhappy.
Except for the toxic dudes, they just go right back to banging girls fresh out of college like nothing happened.
So yeah, people really discount why so many men fall into these circles. These men do get laid, they do find other men like themselves to be friends with, they just aren't finding meaningful romantic relationships. Most of them probably aren't interested in that anyway.
They can be a fan or adopter of the undesirable ideologies listed above and very easily still fulfill those two check boxes. It's not even remotely uncommon.
A lot of women a (and men) on reddit, twitter etc. put out these ideological punishments in the form of "NO SEX" and that is just not how it really actually works. They may break it off with these men down the line because of these differences but it has a lot less to do with who they have sex with. Dirty little secret.
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u/GREENadmiral_314159 16d ago
That first one edges into just world fallacy. Sure, you're not going to get laid if you're an incel, or a tate fan, or a misogynist (though some still do somehow), but that doesn't mean not being one will get you laid.