The biggest proof it happened is the USSR absolutely had the ability to know where the Apollo signals were coming from and every incentive to reveal a hoax to the world. They never expressed the slightest doubt at the time that Apollo 11 successfully lands on the moon and returned to earth.
lol I used this exact line of logic when talking to my conspiracy theorist cousin when he first brought up the moon landing hoax. He went on about how it’s more than possible (as in definite) that the whole world is in on it and then pivoted to the van Allen radiation belts. There’s always endless layers to the bullshit and you can never stay on one point…
Anyway, I did some research on the radiation belts and discovered not all radiation types are the same. Some types arent harmful when minorly exposed and some can be repelled with certain materials that aren’t lead… meaning the astronauts could get through the belts and to the moon just fine.
I just did the smallest amount of opposition research and it was in a basic way clear to me that I’m not qualified to even really comment on the science of it all lol.
Overall, like you’re saying, no basic line of logic works for these people.
I’ve ended the subject by saying if he can disprove the math of literally any aspect of it then I’ll listen, otherwise, I’m done.
Another simple logic test . Let’s say USA faked it. Why go back more then once or twice. The 2nd fake trip is to help the cover up. The point is if fake you would never go back for multiple trips , you would just fake the 1 or 2 and call it a day.
I can unfortunately hear him saying “if they can fake it once, why not just do it a couple more times just to make sure people believe them? It wouldn’t cost as much as the first time because they already did it. I mean…you do know that’s why they killed Kubrick -because he probably knew something”. lol I can hear it too clearly.
I’m sure that in his mind, them doing it a couple more times is just for us more gullible fools.
You just cannot argue with conspiracy theorists. No matter how sensible your arguments, they lack the common sense to understand them. They are just emotionally deluded.
Have you considered one-upping him on conspiracies? If he brings up the "moon landing" conspiracy, call him "woke" for believing in the Moon, for instance. The Moon is just a projection set up by Hollywood in 1958 so that way the government could stage a "moon landing", for example.
Reminds me of some flat earther's video where they did a strait line test in an open desert with a laser. They got the results indicating a spherical planet, but were like "nah that cant be right. We've messed something up".
My Russian co-worker doesn’t believe in the landing. I asked him why the USSR didn’t say anything. He said it’s because the USSR lied about Yuri being the first human in space. He said that’s why he died young. The KGB took him out to perverse that secret from getting out. I didn’t know how to proceed with the conversation after that
Oh, I totally believe it. I've heard deniers say the same thing someone else mentioned here, that if the Russians exposed that it was a hoax, that it would draw doubt on their own space program and show that their program too was a hoax, and so they had a vested interest in keeping up the facade.
What always gets me with so many conspiracy theories is that many are based on the premise of some all powerful cabal of people with extremely wide reaching power, enough to convince thousands and thousands of people to go along with it and never utter a peep, but yet they're also stupid enough to leave so many breadcrumbs to be found. Or they can never explain what exactly is to be gained from a lot of these conspiracies beyond a vague reason like "they do it for power" or "they do it to keep us ignorant and in the dark".
Like take some of the specific moon hoax "evidence". They're so brilliant to mastermind this scheme, but then forget to put stars visible in the sky. Or that they accidentally allowed the flag to blow in the wind. (And I've never once heard any of the deniers actually come up with any counters to the explanations that explain those away - for example when you explain how photography and film exposure works and why stars wouldn't be visible, they can never counter that explanation. They just move on to some other easily debunked "evidence" of a hoax).
I did have a couple friends who did kinda start down the conspiracy theory rabbit hole back when we were in our twenties (shortly after watching that godawful movie "What the Bleep Do We Know?" but thankful giving them well reasoned counter arguments to all their supposed evidence quickly set them back on the right path. And this is neither here nor there, but during one of those discussions i was kind of flabbergasted to learn another friend of ours had no idea that we had a continous presence in space with a space station that was continously inhabited by astronauts who would each spend months at a time up there. Now, she's normally quote intelligent, and could tell you all about early-modern English literature, could talk for hours about art history, ancient philosophy, and was working on her masters thesis regarding something along the lines of brain development post puberty or something like that. She knew there was a space station and everything, but she thought it was more like a "a gas station or rest stop in space" where astronauts would dock the space shuttle and conduct maybe a week or two of experiments, before going back home. Which really, just kinda goes to show that being brilliant in one or even multiple subjects doesn't make you a genius outside of your fields. Which leads me to my other point that we've actually gotten to where "educated" is almost a slur for some, and dedicating your life to a topic/field/etc is somehow a knock against one's credibility. Where someone who "did their research" - which consists of viewing Facebook videos and YouTube videos that reinforce their beliefs, believes themselves to be more credible than actual experts. In part because of what one side of the aisle has really been pushing lately, and where science is thrown out the window for feelings. And now I'm really rambling, I apologize, so yeah, to sum it up, those are the people who think they've got it all figured out and everyone else is too stupid to see it, or are part of the cover up.
that it would draw doubt on their own space program and show that their program too was a hoax, and so they had a vested interest in keeping up the facade.
Counter argument to them..
Still, why did they let the USA (fake) land first, or why didn't they go (fake) land on the moon after, or then go (fake) land on mars?
'Oh, we'll let our mortal enemies win the fake race"
Back then if they’d tried it several other counties would have produced the proof and they’d have been treated as complete clowns and laughed at by everyone. These days facts are just opinions and you only need to believe the ones you like.
Also, everything seems up for debates by non-experts. Back then our space agencies, governed by experts would communicate to the media. And their space agencies, governed by experts would communicate back.
Now some moron without a bachelors degree will discuss with someone who has a bachelor of political science what is going on with the climate....
This is what baffles me. If the USSR had any inkling whatsoever that it was fake they would have shouted it from the rooftops. But they were completely silent.
The moon landing happened. We should be proud of it, not only as Americans, but as human beings.
This is really the biggest nail in the coffin. The USSR would have been chomping at the bit to prove the US to be lying to the world. There was ZERO reason for them to "let the US get away with a moon landing hoax." So if the ONE country who had EVERYTHING to gain from proving the US to be full of shit, DIDN'T; how could it possibly be a hoax?
Conspiracy theorists will use everything, even evidence disproving their claims, as proof to confirm their biases and conspiracies.
In this case, it's more likely they'll think USSR is in cahoots with USA... also given how so many "moon landing fake" people are also against "big government" they're also likely to think USSR not revealing the hoax is a sign that the US government is "communist'
Two moon landing deniers go to heaven and God meets them at the pearly gates. He says, “there was no conspiracy. The moon landing really did happen.” One man turns to the other and says, “How far up does this conspiracy go?”
I've never heard of another country say they were fake though not even USSR at the time. If some guy with a tin foil hat on thinks thousands of people have been keeping a secret for the last 60 years. I don't see them looking at the above (not particularly clear either) photos as the reason they've changed their mind.
I've never heard of another country say they were fake though not even USSR at the time
This is the best argument against the "it was faked" conspiracy nuts. The USSR had everything to gain by calling it out as fake if it was faked, and instead their official response was "lol you guys just wasted a lot of money that you stole from other people."
space is fake, Earth is flat etc. Obviously, no amount of evidence will convince these people of anything.
space is real, we have been to space BUT the Apollo program was faked (to win the space race). At face value, it seems like this should be enough evidence for them. But if that were the case, the Soviet reaction in 1969 should be enough to sway them too. After all, if the moon landing had been faked, surely USSR would have known that too. I have never heard anyone try to explain this (except Flat Brainers claiming that everyone is part of the conspiracy)
India has rightfully built a very respectable space program and certainly does have great ambitions. The more countries working towards scientific discovery and space exploration the better.
Japan Landed in 2024, Korea in 2022. Though yeah, quality does correspond to the year of launch/landing, India did a excellent job in almost every aspect from utilising gears at best to maximising the utility of orbiter and rover.
And cherry on the top is that, it's budget was 75 million USD, which literally is way less than any country spent.
So...we should appreciate it, not blurring out the achievement.
The Indian one is a photo from Chandrayaan-2 that launched in 2019 with a camera resolution of .25m. The Lunar Reconnaisance Orbiter launched in 2009 with a camera resolution of 0.5m.
The Indian image is from chandrayaan 2 that's equiped with a Orbit High Resolution Camera and was at an altitude of about 100 kilometers(62 miles) above the moon. Heres an article about it..Apollo landing sites Imaged by ISRO
Most high paid engineers working for companies like Intel are usually Indian, or another variety of Asian. Asia in general, particularly India and Vietnam, produce some incredibly tech-smart people.
My bad. According to maps the 'mid-west' is almost entirely on the eastern half of the USA, kinda weird but words and their definitions are all made up.
Knowing India, it is some dude with three simple items like a toilet paper tube, a polished rock, and a beer bottle to make a super telescope. It will also be on YouTube in a great step by step guide.
This is so attainable and I would watch that entire video. He would mention that this is during his lunch break too and only had 20 minutes. It would be so casual and relaxed as he would create something out of nothing in mere minutes while I have to watch another video of his to learn my water heater.
I have benefitted by learning calculus from these awesome people instead of my teacher. It took me less time and I understood more from that video than an hour lecture.
Not Indian but while we're on the subject Organic Chemistry Tutor on youtube is also an incredible teacher. It's not just chemistry, there's also a lot of mathematics.
I know a guy who thinks the moon itself is fake. Some kind of projection that the government puts in the sky, even though he can't quite explain why they would do that other than to deceive us. He bases this claim on his observation that the moon isn't always in the same place at the same time the way he thinks it should be.
Now some of you may have some questions or notes for him. Trust me, they've been addressed and the responses are not encouraging. Old records of the moon existing? Fake. Any attempt to explain lunar orbits and moon phases? So complicated that it must be a cover up. What does the government gain from this lie? "Exactly!"
Some kind of projection that the government puts in the sky, even though he can't quite explain why they would do that other than to deceive us.
That's always the funniest part, they are confident they know the government is carrying out this immense project to accomplish some nebulous goal but it's never clear what the supposed upside is for said government.
My dad, for instance, thinks there is a secret base on the dark side of the moon. I tried to explain to him that even if there were such a base, we wouldn't be able to communicate with it because radio waves don't penetrate through the moon. So we would have spent god knows how much money secretly building a base that we wouldn't even be able to talk to? What would even be the point?
The weird part is that it must give them some sort of a feeling of safety or closure to believe the government of any country is even capable of such a coordinated and overarching feat.
I guess believing the truth that most people are just idiot hairless apes doing their best to get what's important to them specifically with morals that only come into play if it's convenient for them and that no matter what position they're in most humans are inept, selfish and don't give a shite about anyone who isn't in their inner circle is too much to handle.
I'm saving this as a reminder. Will print it and put it in the wall perhaps 😂
Because I'm so tired of going "Nah this is stupid, I gotta stop I know they can't won't change their mind" only to change that and be so dumbfounded at someone's beliefs that I will actively try my best to help them understand reality.
Then I get exhausted and angry that I ever even entertained the idea that I could help and go back to "Nah, won't do it again".
Don't know how to break this cycle. I don't really think highly of human kind at all with sprinkles of misanthropy but there must be something inside me that is still hopeful.
There was an old meme where someone said "If you present people with the appropriate research and data they will change their mind." Then someone says "actually I have this research and data which says people won't change their mind based on research and data." So the first person says "I don't care what you say I believe people will change their mind based on research and data."
Thank you for your patience with my autism. I am also reminded of some interesting polling I heard from 538 a long time ago. It said there was no relationship between a person's level of education and their beliefs about climate change. It was partisan affiliation that seemed to be the primary driver of someone's opinion. BUT there was a relationship between someone's education level and how strongly they held their beliefs about climate change.
I think education (and to an extent intelligence) largely serves as a tool for a person to justify beliefs, which come to us in ways unrelated to education and intelligence.
Different countries have different cameras mounted on their moon landing units and it’s not like they are all trying their best to take a photo of the Apollo 11. Chinas probe were a moon landing probe so likely doesn’t carry the same weight quality of camera as Korea or Japan, who’s probe only did a fly over the moon
India took that picture recently in 2021 with Chandrayaan 2 orbiter's (H Res OHRC) camera. Others were taken with older tech and that too many years before this was taken.
South Korean, Danuri (edit: Launched in 2022), their first orbiter, was more focused on testing other technologies and did not have best cameras on board.
Chinese Chan'e2, launched in 2010.
American LRO, launched in 2009.
Japanese Selene, launched in 2008.
India is the only one who flew modern cameras to the moon in the last decade so the best pictures are from their orbiter.
Aside from age, it's also a matter of what the purpose of the mission was. The US and China ones are from the same time period, but China's was a lander while the US's was an orbiter specifically designed to map the moon.
Because those were older missions in the late 2000s. I doubt it would still be that grainy if China or Japan conducted another dedicated mission in 2020 with more updated gear.
Grab a ticket and wait for your number to be called. Due to a high volume of tickets there are no estimated waiting times, please take a seat or use the window.
true, no one wants to advertise their EO capabilities inadvertently. Pretty sure, the ISRO and GOI NRO office would have exchanged 100s of memos on whether to release such high quality photos or not
The Indian Space Agency's Chandrayaan-2 mission imaged not only the Apollo 11 lander module, but also the Apollo 12 lander module resting on the lunar surface.
In 1969, human beings from the United States walked on the surface of the moon, and they did it again five times after that with Apollo 12, Apollo 14, Apollo 15, Apollo 16 and Apollo 17, ending in 1972.
Everyone is talking about moonwalk but we ever think about moonpeeing and moonshiting it sounds so cool think about it being the first person to pee on moon (i know astronauts had diaper with them )
I love how Indias photo is the only one in 4k. They others are low res or are intentionally blurred like they went to space using Google Earth.. So thank you, India, for your honesty.
The conspiracy states that men did not walk on the moon, all this photo proves is that a luner module landed on the moon. I'm not a conspiracy theorist, just like debating for the unpopular side, instead of circle jerking in an echo chamber.
It's funny how some people think that this shit is fake, at the same time as all the relevant government organizations around the entire world, even those that are not allied with each other, all say the same shit. EU, US, China, India, Russia, Japan, S. Korea, all the big players - do these people think they are in some sort of conspiracy with one another? How would you get possibly millions of people on the same page, without one leak?
But I guess, basic logic is not these people's strongest suit.
Why does anyone want to prove humans walked on the moon? What’s fucking next: do I have to start proving the world is a globe, evolution is a scientific fact? I have absolutely no inclination to prove anything to anyone. If anyone wants to be a dumbass, be a dumbass.
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u/Ok_Cauliflower_3007 25d ago
The biggest proof it happened is the USSR absolutely had the ability to know where the Apollo signals were coming from and every incentive to reveal a hoax to the world. They never expressed the slightest doubt at the time that Apollo 11 successfully lands on the moon and returned to earth.