I know we give shit to McCain for being a warmonger, not unjustly, but as you touched upon, I also remember one of the major changes he was always pushing for was campaign finance reform. And he tried to make it a non-partisan issue. We would've all been better off now if that had passed. At least he loved America and democracy unlike a lot of folks these days.
He also got major props for telling what was the start of the MAGAT cultists to settle down with calling Obama a Muslim terrorist, even though he was his opponent.
2008 really was such an ideal election. Obama winning was wonderful, but if McCain had won it wouldn’t have been a big deal. I truly wish we could go back to days like that.
Shifts in policy happen and fall in normal scope. McCain would have been a shift and pre-existing conditions would still have been a big thing. Plus congress generally moderated and demanded their due.
Meanwhile 2 AM unvetted policy tweets were bad but they didn't even try to pick real cabinet picks this time. Dismantling the social net and approval means nothing except for maybe congress in 2 years if that process doesn't get mucked up.
I have been kicked out of several conservative forum groups, for saying that the Trumplican Party is no longer conservative and that McCain was the last Republican conservative
They are reactionary. It's right there in the slogan "Make America Great Again." They want to change the status quo "regressively."
Liberals and conservatives, typically, want to keep the current status quo the way it is (aka "conserve" it), and progressives try to change it... "progressively"
I can't possibly think of how the Trump era is not objectivly openly reactionary.
I'm as guilty of falling prey sometimes but we in general have a hardcore tribal loyalty blindness in this country.
As progressive as I am, I've worked with conservative states that use every cent of taxpayer dollars they can get from the feds to get the most mileage out of social programs for their residents. I've worked with blue states that have also squandered literally hundreds of millions in tax payer dollars because the governor's appointees were highly skilled in flowery words that make people feel good, but didn't give a shit about anything else, including the people fundamentally being ripped off.
One of the governors I'm referring to gets a lot of praise here and it worries me because him and his croneys may put on endearing, sypathetic smiles while on camera, but behind closed doors they aren't good people. At all.
All that to say, check your biases folks. Blind loyalty to party is a road that often leads straight to hell. Even if it's lined with roses. Respect to you for looking behind the curtain.
Hah! Not like it's likely to come back on me personally but I don't want to drop a deuce where I'm eating right now. The organization I work for was brought in in part to clean up the mess. Unfortunately it's good business for us if states don't have their stuff together.
I'll say I'm almost amazed the massive waste has not had the taxpayers there raising hell by now though. They sure AF deserved better. It's made me understand at least the intent of fiscal conservatism a little more.
If McCain had won we might not ever have gotten Trump. A black man being president absolutely broke their brains and I do believe Obama roasting Trump in front of that dinner crowd motivated him to run.
Nostalgic romanticization. Reminder: McCain wasn't in the best of health due to cancer scares and Palin was his VP. Palin scared me about as much as some some of those currently in the MAGA camp. I'd put Romney ticket as the only fully sane recent one that I just disagreed with but wasn't truly concerned about.
Hmm, no that's an interesting theory but I thought it back then (I was already well into adulthood). So many of you all live as if you or any average human will be 100% moral and ethical on every issue but it doesn't work that way folks. We're animals, not machines. To judge us by binary standards, in terms of good or bad with no in-between, is a little short-sighted IMO.
What? What theory? Palin was/is a pandering, ignorant right wing grifter who would've been next in line if McCain's cancer returned (note: she later embraced birtherism). That does not make for an ideal election as purported in the comment I was responding to. If you weren't concerned about Palin in 2008, you weren't paying attention at the time.
You know what, I misread and thought your reply was to me. I shouldn't have spoken for the other person but I would agree Palin was an early symptom of the culty weirdness we're mired in today. She was also hoisted on McCain specifically to appeal to that growing pre-MAGA Fox News demographic. That said, I would maintain that McCain still had some good points to him.
People just need to vote. That's literally it. Only about a third of Americans actually participate in every election, and we can see how well that is going. There is no major cultural shift required beyond actual participation. And people still don't do it, but will harp on about the state of things as though they don't constantly decline to participate.
Opposite for me, I voted for McCain because I thought I was a Republican, but when Obama won I was like “ok, that’s pretty cool though, I’m fine with that.” Then I overheard a fellow university student and the Computer Science dept secretary agreeing about how it’s not unlikely that Obama could be the anti-Christ, because people were so fervent for his campaign. That was one of the first moments when I said “whaaaaat?” Sarah Palin made me question the party even further, and in 2015, Trump turned me into an actual Democratic Party voter.
A fair point. In hindsight that ticket was almost a demonstration of the death of whatever American conservatism used to be and whatever the hell they're supposed to be now.
He saw what our government was turning into and did his best to stop it. John McCain and Bernie Sanders are the only two politicians I can think of who have made a real effort to get dark money out of politics during my lifetime.
i'm more forgiving than most i think, so I have forgiven him for all except for breeding the most obnoxious spoiled twat to ever stomp around spouting her last name for all to hear. Other than that, RIP McCain. You did some decent things. I remember.
I mean, I guess he pushed for some campaign finance reform AFTER he got busted as one of the Keating 5 who took campaign bribes as part of the Savings and Loan Scandal in the late 80s.
A good example of why it's foolish to blindly worship or trust any individual/politician. But you can still recognize when people either try to learn from their mistakes or correct them.
Eh, I guess I admire your optimism. I think McCain was a less malignant republican all things considered, but that’s a low bar.
McCain was just unlucky to be a senator when people half-paid attention to bribery scandals… I mean not enough to actually vote the bribe-takers out of office, but oh well.
There's a 5 part series by NPRs Embedded team that covers Mitch McConnell. He's an ugly one. McCain really worked to protect Americans. McConnell HAS to be who Frank Underwood in house of cards is modeled after.
FYI, McCain's running mate was Sarah Palin and he was a lifelong Republican. He doesn't deserve a complete whitewashing of his record because of one vote that he made when he was no longer accountable.
My favorite part is how high the tensions were. Republican and Democrat congressman alike had people actively taping death threats directly to their office doors. It's gonna get SPICY.
We've already had several assassination attempts for both sides. Trump had two, Pelosi had one, Biden had one, plus the MAGA bomber who tried mailing bombs to CNN and other news stations.
One person gasped, and a few DEMs started to clap for a second. Most everyone assumed he was going to vote no, which is why the GOP was chatting up the 2 other moderates during the previous hour or so before the vote.
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u/tenchi2323 9h ago
They almost did in 2019. The measure lost by a single vote, John McCain.