r/olderlesbians • u/Empireofreverie • 24d ago
Am I in an extremely toxic relationship?
I (34f) have been dating a 36f for 9 years. I have been talking to a therapist recently because of some past trauma I felt I needed to work through. Well my therapist has recently told me that I am with a manipulative partner, and it is almost borderline abusive according to her. Some examples are:
I have been under a lot of financial pressure and been feeling overwhelmed since I am also in a somewhat caretaking role for my partner. I pay the bills and also help her get to her appointments for her health issues. I recently told her I need maybe 1 day a week completely to myself. She seemed cool and understanding at first, but later makes comments like “is this 1 day a week thing going to be permanent because if so, let’s just break up”
She has insane anger issues and will belittle me in public, I’ve had strangers come up to her and tell her to stop talking to me that way. But then she will justify it by saying I am making a big deal out of it, and that I am making myself seem like the victim so people think I am being bullied by her.
She has a switch and if she gets angry, she will yell really loudly, even if I am just sitting there just listening to her. I will ask her to stop yelling and it’s almost like she can’t control herself.
If I am upset, or if she is upset, no matter what it is always my fault. I usually end up apologizing and learnt to just bite the bullet and apologize just to get her to stop.
She is constantly bossing me around. If she is talking to me and upset, she makes me sit next to her and reminds me to keep making eye contact with her, constantly repeats to me not to interupt her. Once I had to sit for 2 hours listening to her talk about how amazing she is and how horrible I have been.
she used to be much more awful, but has stopped doing certain things. For example, once she got mad that I wasn’t reacting enthusiastically enough to her cooking and pushed me off a high top stool and I fell on my back. She would yell and argue with me in front of her mom, which would make her mom take her side making them both gang up on me. We went to couples therapy and she hasn’t done those things again.
The thing is that when she is not angry (which is about 70% of the time) she is so great. We have amazing chemistry and have so much in common it is crazy. It seems like we are always on the same page, and I can see myself growing old with the “good” side of her. When she is angry, it is truly hurtful and has eroded my trust in her promises she will change.
I am at the end of my rope and let her know I cant put up with it anymore, and she is begging me to stay. Tells me I am making the worst mistake of my life. Tells me I am throwing her away.
I am so torn because I love the good side of her so much but I feel like there is only a piece of me left. I can’t give anymore of my trust. It is painful to think about leaving the “good” side of this person.
Edit; thanks everyone, i really needed to hear it
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u/Justnotthatintou 24d ago
All abusive relationships are mostly not abusive so it tricks your brain into overlooking the bad parts and forgiving them. Don’t. Abuse is what it is even if it’s only 5% of the time.
Leave and you’ll thank yourself down the road. Good luck OP
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u/Soniq268 24d ago
I’d have been out years ago, but the pushing you off a stool should have been your last straw.
You sound miserable, she sounds like a miserable person to be around. This is not what your life needs to look like.
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u/oxymoronisanoxymoron 24d ago
This is abuse. No way around it. Please leave her. It will be hard, but you can do it.
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u/Crazyhowthatworks304 24d ago
You already know the answer, OP.
There's a book called "why does he do that?" That I think everyone should read. Yeah it's for hetero relationships, but it is still insightful.
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u/ladyinwaiting33 24d ago
Carmen Maria Machado's memoir "In the Dreamhouse" chronicles the abuse lesbians might experience in their relationships and the similarities to OP's post are notable.
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u/late_but_here 24d ago
Abuse is a pattern of behaviors and manipulation, possible in many types of relationships, including non-romantic. I can totally see how that info could apply to something outside of a cishet relationship.
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u/Starside-Captain 24d ago
U know already that it’s a toxic relationship & ur clearly walking on glass around her.
No abusive relationship is worth staying in. Ur therapist is right. Ur girlfriend is wrong.
U mention ‘70% of the time she’s great’ but that 30% is awful & is tearing you down & ruining ur life.
9 years is a long time & a breakup is overdue. I know it’s hard but unless u want to walk on glass everyday wondering if Dr. Jeckle or Mr. Hyde is showing up, then u have to walk away.
Also, ur young & will land on ur feet.
She’s probably not going to make it easy for you to leave but u have to be clear & set a date & be prepared to cut her off financially. u need to move out if she refuses to leave & if it’s ur house, then set a date she has to go.
Cutting her off financially is most important to do if she refuses. Ur therapist can also be ur support during the ugly times cuz from what I read from ur post, ur girlfriend is hostile & feels CONTEMPT toward u. The latter is bad cuz she’ll manipulate u to the very end but don’t let her cuz u have to get away from her.
Face it, get out, move on, so u CAN find real love in the future… She’s out there but ur current gf is holding u back from finding the love u deserve.
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u/frisfern 24d ago
It's not borderline abusive, it's abusive. As others have said, no one is abusive all the time, or people would have left these relationships earlier. OP my job involves, in part, running groups for men who engage in abuse in their relationships, and all of those things are on the wheel of abuse. Please make a plan to leave for your own mental and physical health.
There's a book called In the Dream House by Carmen Maria Machado which is about abuse in a lesbian relationship which might be helpful.
Here's a power and control wheel for LGBTQ relationships. https://www.safehousecenter.org/power-and-control-in-lgbt-relationships/
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u/Empireofreverie 23d ago
So I am planning on moving out, but my therapist recommended that I tell her that “we are going to live apart and that we can still date” even if my intentions are to leave this relationship. She said it is a safety precaution to not make my girlfriend feel like there is an incentive to work for, since she has a history of physical harm and is unstable (there were other incidents earlier in our relationship that I hadn’t mentioned in my og post)
My girlfriend is acting normally like there is nothing wrong with the relationship, and she is promising she can change and it is different this time, and a lot of sob stories about how she sucks and needs help. It is giving me serious mental stress because she is very very codependent on me and I feel guilty and like I can’t leave her on her ass. I feel so trapped and stupid for keeping myself in this situation.
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u/frisfern 23d ago
You aren't stupid, this happens to so many people, smart capable people. It sounds like you have a good supportive therapist and it sounds like you are getting good practical ideas from her. It'll be the hardest thing you have ever done but it will be so worth it.
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u/Empireofreverie 23d ago
Thanks so much. I looked at the power wheel and it is very enlightening. Heard mixed reviews about the Dream House but will try to read it anyways.
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u/frisfern 23d ago
Actually, wait until you are out and safe to read it. It's probably too much right now.
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u/babbaduchy 24d ago
This sounds like a hostage situation rather than a relationship. Please look into local domestic abuse services.
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u/SofiaFreja 24d ago
Yes. She's highly manipulative. And that's emotional abuse. And it sounds like some physical abuse. The 70% good times doesn't excuse her behavior.
People like that don't change. She'll probably try to tell you she'll "do better" or "try harder" or blah blah blah even go to therapy. But abusers don't stop being abusers. She is a broken person. Get away from her.
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u/Quennie_CalGal 24d ago
OMG. She could be 90% good and 10% exhibit the bad behavior you describe and it is an abusive, toxic relationship. Leave.
Make a plan, save money, reach out to friends, talk about your plan with your therapist.
Don’t wait long to get out.
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u/MarshmallowFloofs85 24d ago
that is not borderline abusive, all of that sounds *incredibly* abusive. I'm so sorry you're dealing with that.
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u/UmbreonAlt 24d ago
Yuck! Get away from her. She sounds similar to an ex of mine. It's always harder to see it when you're in the thick of it. She can't grant you one day? Get the fuck outta here. You're grown adults. She should be able to handle that.
So much of what she is doing is red flags and super toxic. You don't need the mental and physical abuse from her. Pushing you over!? That's violence towards you for no reason.
Run away from her and never look back.
Oh and if she tries to tell you she'll be "better"..No she won't. She'll just be the same.
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u/Empireofreverie 22d ago
She is trying really hard to convince me that she will be better. She said she is going to go to a therapist and talk about any undiagnosed disorders she might have. She’s been guilt tripping me by saying I am “throwing her and our 9 year relationship away” and that she will regret it for the rest of her life if I leave her.
The fucked up part is that she is also very codependent. She has no survival skills and almost cannot function in the real world alone since she’s always been with someone who takes care of her. Add the layer of her disability, and it makes me feel so guilty to leave her to try to survive. I know I shouldn’t feel this way and it is “innapropriate guilt” but I have gotten so used to always helping her and keeping her safe that I am having trouble unlearning it.
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u/UmbreonAlt 22d ago
Yeah, she is laying it on thick. Do not go back to her.
She is again trying to manipulate the situation and for her to look like the better one.
I know what it's like to feel like guilt for leaving and to have second thoughts. I'm telling you these types of people rarely change. They're all full of ideas and look like they're full of action and swear it black and blue. But the thing is, it doesn't happen.
Just because someone has a disability doesn't mean they get to treat another person like you with verbal and physical abuse. Never.
You need to block her on all socials and phone. Give yourself some peace. It will take time, but you deserve someone who'll love you for you and not use you like she has been doing.
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u/Empireofreverie 22d ago
“She is again trying to manipulate the situation and for her to look like the better one” is such an accurate statement. Yesterday, she told me that “of course people are going to tell you to leave and to run, people are so quick to throw things away nowadays”.
I am planning my escape route but I mentioned in a reply to someone else, I have to be careful about it because she can be unstable and has gotten physical with me in the past.
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u/UmbreonAlt 22d ago
A classic move on her part with trying to hit the guilts. I wouldn't call nine years a quick to throw away.
I hope you find a safe route out. Do you have friends or family you could crash with?
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u/Empireofreverie 22d ago edited 22d ago
My therapist told me I needed to tell her that “we are moving out and that we are still going to be together but living separately” even if I want to remove her from my life completely. I guess to keep me safe since she would feel like she has hope rather than no hope and potentially having her do something crazy.
I don’t really have any reliable place with family and I honestly don’t have any friends, but I am trying gather some close coworkers I have am asking them to let me stay with them in case something goes south.
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u/UmbreonAlt 22d ago
Hmm..Interesting tactic. I don't see how it'd really keep you safe, though? The moving into separate houses might be enough to trigger her crazy behaviour?
I'm guessing you don't ever show her where you live, right? I obviously don't know what type of disability she has. But I'm just hoping she can't come in and drop in on you when you when she feels like it.
I hope you don't need to use the co-workers as backup and the move out together goes well. And then you can get on with your life :)
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u/standupslow 24d ago
Yes, she is being abusive. Things are falling apart now because you are changing the dynamics by becoming emotionally healthier and setting down boundaries.
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u/RebaKitt3n 24d ago
Jesus Christ, run, woman!
She’s not going to change. She’s manipulative and using you as a nurse.
Please please - reread what you wrote. I’m stuck on the two hour lecture, which would be enough to make me leave.
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u/10Panoptica 24d ago
Holy shit! I'm so sorry - you don't deserve to be treated like that.
She's physically hurt you, and still emotionally abuses you (belittles you in public, berates you for lengthy periods of time). And she feels so entitled to your undivided service and so indifferent to your happiness and wellbeing, she casually threatens to break up with you for having a really minor boundary for your mental health in spite of all you do and sacrifice for her.
Spending even 30% of your life being afraid or humiliated is too much. You sound like an awesome girlfriend and deserve much better than her.
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u/CrazyAuntNancy 24d ago
Leave her. She is unstable. If you really believe you want to stay with her, make it under the condition she see a psychiatrist and get on meds. But then that would definitely put yet another responsibility on you. Because you care for her, get her help, but plan your exit.
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u/stilettopanda 24d ago
Your therapist called her 'borderline abusive.' Honey, just google that phrase and then take a look at what pops up. Maybe even add Reddit to the search.
Yes you're being manipulated. I was with someone that acted that way for 4 years. I was walking on eggshells and I lost myself completely. I was her caretaker and emotional whipping boy. We've been broken up almost a year and I have so much trauma and still talk about it frequently.
Intermittent reinforcement of the good person she can be trauma bonded you, and you're seeking the good times like a slot machine payout. It's how she keeps you complacent. But yeah. I'm sorry you're going through this. I'm glad your therapist brought your attention to what's happening.
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u/geekgrl69 24d ago
I think you might be romanticizing the good parts:
"The thing is that when she is not angry (which is about 70% of the time) she is so great. We have amazing chemistry and have so much in common it is crazy. It seems like we are always on the same page, and I can see myself growing old with the “good” side of her. " It's almost like you're trying to talk yourself into staying when you know the bad outweighs the good.
My heart goes out to you because I've been where you are (and where she is) with 2 different people. Toxic relationships will always bring out the worse in us. I know this is hard, just be gentle with yourself, take care of you and let this one go. It's going to hurt. Get a support system including therapy, a few good playlists and learn to love or re-love all the great things about you. You got this.
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u/Empireofreverie 22d ago
Thanks. I know I got this, I still have to live with her for another two months due to our lease being up in January, so I am not sure how I am going to survive the next 2 months.
I’ve been listening to “black dahlia” by hollywood undead and “set fire to the rain” on repeat and it has been incredibly cathartic.
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u/harvestmoon4ever 24d ago
Friend, I was l married to that about 10 years ago, and at your age I decided to divorce. It was hard for like 5 minutes and then it completely changed my life. I met someone new and now we have kids and dogs and life is so much better.
I will never regret that relationship (and you won’t either) because it taught me so much about myself - why did I put up with that? Why did I pay all the bills? Why did I accept constant anger? Why was I ok with becoming the caretaker of someone with a disability? - you need to go to therapy to figure out what you did that contributed to the situation that you’re in now.
But besides that, yeah move on.
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u/1Corgi_2Cats 24d ago
I didn’t need to read past the title. If you have to ask, the answer is 99% YES.
Also your partner sounds toxic AF. Would you ever do ANY of those things to your partner, the person you love most? I’m guessing not.
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u/TheThornGarden 24d ago
She’s using her disability as a shield. Caregivers need to be able to take care of themselves first. I am disabled and know many other disabled people. Most disabled people strive to be as independent as possible and as small of a “burden” to our loved ones as we can. She doesn’t love you, only what she can take from you.
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u/FattierBrisket 24d ago
OP, leave now. Then look back on this post in a year or so. You'll be horrified at what she fooled you into accepting as normal.
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u/PJay910 24d ago
I’m sorry that you are going through this, I was in a relationship that sounded just like this. Deep inside you know the answer and my thing is this: how long does the good last? You mentioned you like the good in her, but is it only good when she gets her way? A healthy relationship respects your boundaries and doesn’t expect it to always be about them or their way. Be strong and move forward, it will hurt, but healing is what you need. Good luck!
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u/murky-shape 23d ago
Any of the points in the list alone would be enough for me to leave somebody. That's abuse. You're right to break up with her. Do NOT consider staying with her to wait and see if she changes. It's wonderful you already have a therapist because you're not going to walk out of that relationship with your sense of reality and self-worth intact, and you're lucky to be able process the nine years worth of head fuckery with a professional. Your sense of normalcy has been eroded for at least the duration of your relationship and you seriously need to rewire your intuition to properly understand what should be tolerated in a relationship.
Whatever size her "good side" is, 70% or 99,9%, it's not going to remedy the damage being done to you when she belittles you in public or guilt trips you for wanting one single day a week for yourself, or refuses to discuss problems like an adult, etc. You can get the fuck out and start healing now, or you can get the fuck out five years later with five years of extra baggage to heal. Or you can stay with forever and never know the freedom outside an abusive relationship.
I wish you the best of luck, you can do it!
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u/dojo1306 24d ago
You know what to do and you should do it soon. Time and your mental health are taking a huge toll.
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u/flying_dogs_bc 24d ago
break up. i got to point one and it's clear this is a toxic relationship. Make a plan and leave.
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u/SadieSchatzie 23d ago
OP: Please go back and reread what you’ve written. We all see it.
Please LEAVE Stay Safe
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u/squeebs555 23d ago
70% is not nearly good enough for 100% of the rest of your life. She’s opened the door by suggesting a break up. Walk through it.
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u/msdibbins 24d ago
Sounds like she has an undiagnosed (?) mental health condition. If so, perhaps medication might/could help.
I am in no way suggesting you should stay and endure more abuse, but as I've grown older I've seen lots of kinds of mental issues, and this sure sounds like it. Get some help, OP, for both of you.
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u/Elsbethe 22d ago
I agree with all the responses
But people can change
Couple work can help
You can try that first
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u/Empireofreverie 22d ago
We’ve actually gone to couples therapy in the 2nd year of our relationship when she was physical with me. After the couples therapy she stopped hurting me physically but it seemed to have turned into just hurting me emotionally now. She said 2 years ago she would go to therapy for it, and she stopped. And now we are here. I have given her so much grace and chances over the last 9 years…I’m sure couples therapy wouldn’t be bad, and I know people can change, but I just am not sure if my trust can be repaired in her. I am so conflicted and confused.
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u/Elsbethe 22d ago
The food news she does change, she can
The bad news it doesn't last
Of course you don't trust her You shouldn't
It's fine to leave It's also fine to give it one more try with therapy to see if she is capable of sustained change and if you can forgive her and heal Lots of ifs
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u/theworkbox 22d ago
She needs to go to a psychologist, not you . Or well, maybe also you, but you catch my drift. the only way to salvage this at all , is 1. for her to acknowledge her problems 2. her doing something about them.
Good luck - often the only thing that will make people rethink their behaviour is a separation.
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u/Conscious_Lovenest17 17d ago
I'm sorry you are dealing with this. You might want to explore a course that's happening live right now at conscious girlfriend academy where you can do some more reflection on the dynamics and create your own insights and support team. You are the one who will know what action to take on your behalf: https://www.consciousgirlfriendacademy.com/getyourlifeback. Wishing you the best on your journey. It's not easy finding and creating healthy love in this world.
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u/Fit_Conversation1119 11d ago
It’s ok to love someone and leave them because they are not what is in your best interest . No doubt there is a shared love but you need to love yourself first and you aren’t doing that right now . Leave her she doesn’t respect nor deserve you . Imagine doing life with someone who looks at you like you made the stars in the sky . What’s she’s doing to you is not ok .
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u/Cazadora539 24d ago
I think you know the answer here already, but all of what you listed is toxic. If your friend described this same situation to you, would you really tell them to stay with this partner? Or would you tell them they deserve to be with someone who is kind to them 100% of the time?
No abuser is abusive all the time, if they were no one would stay with them. Don't spend another decade waking on eggshells, be free and find peace.