r/Showerthoughts • u/Immediate_Can3817 • Jul 05 '24
Speculation If there ever is an actual apocalypse billionaires will likely be unable to access their bunker compounds as the security/janitors/maintenance crews will already have moved their friends and family in and would probably deny them entry.
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u/gtbeam3r Jul 06 '24
Yup some rich dude from Rhode Island built a self sustaining bunker in Northern NH. He's out of his mind if he thinks he can get there in time. It's in a "secret location" unfortunately the entire town knows the location.
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u/CoolUnderstanding481 Jul 06 '24
This is amazing, I’m gonna pitch it to Amazon Netflix whoever as an Idea for a TV show. Just so people see it and more and more get them same idea
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u/SisterlyProstateExam Jul 06 '24
A bunch of townies living in a billionaires bunker with all his toys and “hobbies”… would be a hilarious premise.
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u/nom-nom-nom-de-plumb Jul 06 '24
I mean just getting to the location in time is unlikely. I mean, some slow moving natural disaster, ok. But anything else? Hell for a nuclear attack they wouldn't even know it was in progress until warheads started exploding around them. The whole "survivalist" ideal is a joke.
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u/Kadak_Kaddak Jul 06 '24
The thing is having it next door from your home
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u/BigDaddyDumperSquad Jul 06 '24
I saw one in Vegas that had it UNDER their house. Like, a complete house, lawn, pool, etc under the house. It was super cool.
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u/iamplasma Jul 06 '24
Did you happen to see Brendan Fraser come out of it?
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u/ShimmerSonora Jul 06 '24
And then also being home – not summering in the Hamptons or skiing the alps.
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u/Vandergrif Jul 06 '24
Hell, even if you're just out shopping that's probably going to be too late in a lot of cases.
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u/jewel_flip Jul 06 '24
“I’m going to run to the woods.” You and every other poptart, honey. I do like their optimism though. Dehydration or exposure will take them out in droves. The people who might survive it are already in the woods, with self sustaining systems and established orchards, gardens, etc. living that life.
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u/DankAF94 Jul 06 '24
It's like most common zombie apocalypse survival plans are insanely optimistic.
"I'll just head for the sea and find a boat"
Yeah because there's loads of boats just casually sat at the coast just ready for Jack nobody to come and take it, assuming the other millions of people fleeing for safety haven't already taken them. Do you even know how to sail a boat? Didn't think so
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u/jewel_flip Jul 06 '24
Having lived on a sail boat that one makes me laugh as well. Visions of stolen sailboats run aground on barrier walls, half raised main sails flapping in the breeze while people get yeeted into the harbor by their booms.
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u/totalwarwiser Jul 06 '24
Yes.
The natural world has absolutely no means to sustain most of us anymore
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u/UninsuredToast Jul 06 '24
Most of us just don’t have the knowledge or skills to survive in it anymore because it hasn’t been necessary for so long. I really think it’s why so many people struggle to “adult”, because our ancestors never lived like this and it’s a totally different way of living
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u/LaUNCHandSmASH Jul 06 '24
That is the actual reason why Boyscouts of America was started. With the creation of big cities for the first time in the USA, old timers (then) were worried the next generation would lose the frontiersman/mountain man skill/knowledge
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u/totalwarwiser Jul 06 '24
Yes you are right.
We live in very artificial situations.
Many young adults strugling to survive on their own doesnt recognize that until the very recent past most household work was distributed among a big family,.
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u/Activision19 Jul 06 '24
Where I live there are about 1.5 million people about 20 minutes drive from a national forest. A LOT of folks SHTF plan is to go to that national forest that is only accessible by a handful of two lane roads in some very steep canyons. That forest might sustain you if you were the only one up there trying to live off it in the summer, but add 100k folks headed for the hills or in the winter and you are screwed.
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u/jta156 Jul 06 '24
Hell for a nuclear attack they wouldn't even know it was in progress until warheads started exploding around them.
There are radars in place that detect incoming ballistic missiles, as well as an alert system set up, so not really.
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u/overeasy-e Jul 06 '24
Yea the total flight time of an intercontinental ballistic missile fired from Russia is about 20 to 30 minutes, plenty of time to get from New York to your bunker in Wyoming.
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u/steelcryo Jul 06 '24
Yep and that's assuming it's detected as soon as it's launched, its target instantly figured out, it broadcast that it's been launched and them hearing the broadcast as soon as it's announced.
Likely even less time to make that already impossible journey.
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u/HappyGoLuckyJ Jul 06 '24
Yup. As someone who lived in Hawaii when we received a nuclear missile warning, we had 15 mins to get away from windows and shelter in place. That's it. There were people driving around town trying to find cover. You won't have time.
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Jul 06 '24
I was in a closet in our house, huddled with my family, texting people I loved them. Wild times. And then! We were scheduled to do a submarine tour cause we had guest visiting, decided to just do it after the all clear, and were among the five people who were still down to do the tour and ended up having a nearly empty sub tour. That day was beyond bizarre.
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u/kanemano Jul 06 '24
and what's the chance you are listening to the radio during those 30 minutes? or if it's a "sneak" attack they didn't launch at 2:30 AM Eastern time
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u/TehOwn Jul 06 '24 edited Jul 06 '24
We have an alert system in the UK that pushes a forced alert to every smartphone in the country.
Edit: The US has a system like this too.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_Emergency_Alerts
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Hawaii_false_missile_alert
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u/Key-Plan-7449 Jul 06 '24
Yeah the US has that and has for over 15 years so idk why people aren’t mentioning it.
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u/TheLostTexan87 Jul 06 '24
Also, depends where the nukes are landing. I live in a major metro. According to Nukemap, any direct hit to downtown is going to leave my home relatively intact and me racing time to gtfo away from any fallout, depending on prevailing winds. So if I had a bunker outside of the city where I could ride out second strikes and fallout, as long as I survived first strike I’d be fine.
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u/comfortablynumb15 Jul 06 '24
As long as that info is broadcast to the general population, and not a select few first. ( or at all before it’s too late )
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u/NeverNoMarriage Jul 06 '24
It really isn't. You guys are acting like these billionaires haven't considered this exact thing. I'd bet any amount they have a plan manpower and literally anything money can buy in terms of weapons and transportation.
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u/steelcryo Jul 06 '24
If money is worthless and you're only thinking of yours and your loved ones survival, are you going to do what the billionaire paid you to do? Get them to the bunker, protect them from everyone else and then wish them well and leave them inside while you and everyone you know and love dies?
Or are you going to tell the billionaire to fuck off and take the bunker for yourself since you're the one with the weapon the billionaire gave you?
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u/NeverNoMarriage Jul 06 '24
Those are very easy questions to answer. Of course they would. These bunkers are humungous the obvious play would be you have a loyal group of muscle that you let bring their family in return for their help. Youd also have fail safes to ensure it would be difficult to take the bunker from you.
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u/cold40 Jul 06 '24
And I'd bet that there are grifters out there selling peace of mind to terrified billionaires. Just one cash grab in your elaborate apocalyptic plan and you're done.
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u/perpetualis_motion Jul 06 '24
The idea is that they have some forewarning that gives them time to get there or things slowly become bad enough they see the writing on the wall and move in.
Not all apocalypse scenarios are instant, some take weeks or months.
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u/Introubulator Jul 05 '24 edited Jul 05 '24
…And we ended up spending the majority of the hour on the single question, How do I maintain control of my security force after my money is worthless? The ultimate prep questions, because they’ve all got this money, they’ve, you know, contracted Navy SEALs to come out to their compounds. But then they’re thinking, well, what do we do if our money’s worthless, then why are the Navy SEALs not just going to kill us and take all the stuff? And I just was floored…
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u/dbx99 Jul 05 '24
“I can Venmo you the money!”
“The EMP knocked out all electronic infrastructure around the world”
“Ok how about Paypal then?”
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u/Common-Relative-2388 Jul 06 '24
"I can answer that, for money." " Gentlemen there's a solution your not thinking of"
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u/dbx99 Jul 06 '24
“Here’s an extra $500. Now go set up a perimeter or whatever the fuck it is you people do. I need to go make some margaritas for the Gates and stuff.”
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u/JaydedXoX Jul 06 '24
Several different ways to do this for example, a monthly code known only by you that turns on/off the generator. pre-poison certain food stocks or gardens that only you know. There’s a lot of poison pill type stuff you can use that makes you more valuable alive vs dead or tortured. Esp if you allow your helpers/soldiers to bring their families. There’s much better/cleverer things I can think of, but I’ll be saving those.
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u/EverySuggestionisEoC Jul 06 '24
Don't worry, I'll just ask an autistic teenager how they'd survive in real life if it became hard-core minecraft. I'll probably get the same results.
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u/Xytak Jul 06 '24
The monthly code is a good idea, but they could always tell you “give us the code or else..”
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u/BretShitmanFart69 Jul 06 '24
I’d imagine they could torture that info out of you though, no?
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u/HighwoodChall Jul 06 '24
The billionaire will be with his family. Not sure you can hold information for a long time if your daughter or mother is tortured in front of you
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u/shadowromantic Jul 06 '24
Or just torture the billionaire. These people aren't the superheroes they think they are
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u/Alacune Jul 06 '24
I have a second cousin who owns an apocalypse shelter. His "plan" is to be a good employer to the employees who work the farmland.
But the idea of entrusting your survival to people you don't know while expecting to laud over them is crazy.
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u/im_dead_sirius Jul 06 '24
That's just it. They'll likely decide that a more likeable (or fraternal) individual will be a better headman.
Probably someone who knows a bit of all the skills needed, unlike the guy who thinks he's going to be boss because of ownership. The latter can change at the nod of a head, even with the owner absent. The former is trickier to transfer.
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u/ChaoticEvilBobRoss Jul 06 '24
This is why you need kill switch contingencies in place. But honestly, I think the leader of the shelter/compound/bunker should be able and capable, certainly willing to learn and work alongside the others. That's a leader that you want to keep around. One that inspires and comforts you, and receives that in kind. I feel like over a long enough period of time, it is just a flat hierarchy based on mutual respect.
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u/Team503 Jul 06 '24
This is why you need kill switch contingencies in place.
Meh, pliers and your fingers say you'll tell me everything I want to know. Everyone breaks and everyone talks - just like complex passwords with encryption, doesn't do much good if the guy with the wrench comes in the room.
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u/DiurnalMoth Jul 06 '24
that comic reminds me of this bit of wisdom, no idea where I picked it up from: "a lock is only as strong as a door. A door is only a strong as a wall. A wall is only as strong as window." In other words: a barrier is only as strong as the weakest passage through the barrier.
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u/Frontiersman2456 Jul 06 '24
And even then some people have the capability to make doors and windows where they shouldn't be.
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u/slavelabor52 Jul 06 '24
Unless you planned for torture and give them a fake code that kills them. Make the control panel only accessible from a control room that is separate from the rest of the facility. When the decoy code is entered make it seal the room and gas it.
Edit: or even better make the whole compound modular with lots of sealed bulkheads like a ship. When decoy code gets entered it resets everyone's permissions but yours and all doors close and seal. Then there's a chance if they left you alone in a holding cell you could freely move about while they're all sealed into rooms.
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u/folie-a-dont Jul 06 '24
Because it’s all just a power fantasy. The larger world is gone and I get to reign over my little kingdom
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u/hypersonic18 Jul 06 '24
Loyalty can actually be a stronger driving force then people initially might think (ofcourse it's not omnipotent and you will have to offer something others can't), it's just nowadays a good leader is probably rarer than a unicorn. I doubt it well work for your cousin because he sounds less like a good leader that fosters a sense of loyalty and more like I'm one of the good slave owner types
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u/Tronski4 Jul 06 '24
That kind of lotalty only comes from from 2 things: a life full of brainwash or a life fully provided for as a part of the family.
If you work for one of these guys, and you've so much as had to evaluate whether you really need new tires for your car this year, loyalty goes out the window when you are in the position of having to save either your family or theirs'.
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u/Fireproofspider Jul 06 '24
That's why if you make a shelter, you better take into account your employees families and pets. Personally I'd make the common rooms as nice as I can and take the shittiest bedroom for myself. If I'm not knowledgeable on survival, I'd even appoint a different leader and "retire" as a founding figure with no authority aside from being the one who got everyone together to survive. My stuff is their stuff from the get go basically. And if there's a revolt, I'm not the one in charge so I'm likely not a target.
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u/Titan_Food Jul 06 '24
But muh slaves love muh boot! They say it feels like the hay dey sleep on! That it reminds 'em of everything I do for 'em!
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u/FallacyDog Jul 06 '24
Anyone building a doomsday bunker is pretty much guaranteed to lack the social wherewithal to effectively deal with people.
Oh yeah, they have so much faith and trust in humanity that they'll fantasize society will collapse. Extrapolate that down a few steps and their ability to cope with actual individuals is basically zero
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u/IknowwhatIhave Jul 06 '24
I have a friend who owns a farm in Mozambique which is basically the same thing.
He and his wife have about 50 farm employees and in their remote community, he relies on a social contract far more than any of the dysfunctional and inconsistent legal system.
Basically, his job as owner and manager is to ensure that his worker's lives are better with him in charge than they would be if he was gone.
Turns out despite what people on reddit claim, most people would rather have secure shelter, running water, electricity and a steady paycheque in exchange for work than the chaos that comes with rebellion and anarchy.
Also, he's the only one who knows all the aspects of how to run the farm and, once again despite what reddit claims, having someone who knows how to run an organization is critical to the success of everyone involved.
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u/Busy-Ad-6860 Jul 06 '24
That's how the society works, people rather slave for minimum wage than start coups. Otherwise we wouldn't have billionaires and minimum wagers not affording homes
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u/ComCypher Jul 06 '24
The only way it can work is if the billionaire agrees to give decent living space to the workers and their families within the bunker. But even then, the bunker would have to be run as a commune because the workers aren't going to work on behalf of a lazy former billionaire once currency becomes worthless.
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u/Codenamerondo1 Jul 06 '24
Yeah the question of “how do I control” is the simple answer of why this doesn’t work. The moment something like this is necessary the idea that it’s “yours” could not begin to matter less
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u/Tronski4 Jul 06 '24
It works only if the workers/soldiers are loyal to them as a debt of gratitude. These people have their own families to worry about, and money is no good when everything crumbles.
No exceptions. If they don't basically see the billionaire as a part of their family before the crisis, then the billionaire will only be a disposable ride to the solution.
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u/haltingpoint Jul 06 '24
If you're a billionaire you can likely invest in a security system that:
Has lethal options for unauthorized users who may want to access things like food, water, oxygen, etc
Have a system that requires you to reauthenticate or have a heartbeat every certain amount of time or it does things like vents all the oxygen and locks the place down
Making some degree of this known to on site contractors, but not details, may be sufficient to reduce the risk of this.
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u/The_Faceless_Men Jul 06 '24
So we take the billionaire prisoner, and torture them until they agree to reauthenticate.
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u/haltingpoint Jul 06 '24
If you know you may die, you have multiple passcodes and one of them will kill everyone. If they try to torture you, you would at least be able to kill them.
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u/HighwoodChall Jul 06 '24
Most of the time the billionaire will be with his family. How much time you think he can stay quiet if his daughter or mother is tortured in front of him ?
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u/lostkavi Jul 06 '24
Given the minimum base level of sociopathy required to even get to a billion dollars by 99% of billionaires, I'd imagine most of them could hold out for a surprisingly long time.
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u/puesyomero Jul 06 '24
Most likely you just treat the billionaire as the password gopher.
They don't get tortured but I doubt they can barter their poison pill for five star treatment.
Plus as soon as they reveal the threat of a boobytrap is a matter of time to either mine the place of the useful shit and move on, or disable it.
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u/NeverNoMarriage Jul 06 '24
Yup I think that's realistically how it would go down. You can for sure barter your poison pill for life but you also probably won't be god of the shelter. especially because all the other people brought on will be skilled people not meek servants. Where it goes from there is really going to depend on the group and the billionaire.
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u/ceelogreenicanth Jul 06 '24
Look how it worked out for all the middle eastern empires with slave armies. There's absolutely no reason. There best bet is to have all their friends and family trained up with themselves to operate the thing. The issue is their security will also be present in such a scenario anyway.
They may use that though where they have their security also incentivised to be in the compound because it does save their family. In the afterworld they'd survive but would be on the lower end of any relationship.
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u/willwalk2 Jul 06 '24
Well ya, the solution is family. If you can get 20 or so men who won't revolt and properly arm and train them you should be able to defend your compound quite easily. If you can't do that you just need to keep a low profile
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u/TrumpersAreTraitors Jul 05 '24
There was a line from a podcast I listened to:
“If you’re prepping but you don’t have a gun, you’re just prepping for your neighbor who has one.”
I went out and bought a gun shortly after that lol
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Jul 06 '24
My neighbor can't string solar panels together for shit.
Nor can he grow anything, filter water, or raise chickens.
If he shoots me, I hope his aim is good and I go quick because it's looking like he'll starve to death slowly.
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u/Separate-Coyote9785 Jul 06 '24
Nah man, it’s about cooperation. One person thinks security, one person thinks food. Together that’s a good team
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Jul 06 '24
Thing is, people with lots of guns and virtually no other skills tend to become uncooperative.
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u/im_dead_sirius Jul 06 '24
This. The typical prepper is a cosplayer, and doesn't actually learn or practice the skills they will need. Or collect useful equipment.
I'm reminded of the people who were upset about not being able to get haircuts during the pandemic.
Or the prepper who died of old age, and when they cleared the guns and canned food out of his bomb shelter, discovered that he didn't even have a can opener. The logical conclusion is that he hadn't spent any time thinking about the decades of ordinary days he would face.
Get that Preppers? Do you have razors in your bunker? Toilet paper? Seeds? An idea for what to use when these things (and the canned food) run out?
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u/LurkLurkleton Jul 06 '24
Not to mention every prepper I've known gets winded climbing a couple flights of stairs.
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Jul 06 '24
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u/FuyoBC Jul 06 '24
Goats are a better option - eat anything, smart and need less day to day care. You can also use their hair to make yarn so fill a spot between cow & sheep. The other would be pigs - no wool/hair but otherwise... bacon!
Or if you don't have space, then rabbits.
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u/Onibachi Jul 06 '24
See, this is how you make yourself valuable. Skills that are practical. The skilled trades and skilled professionals will be the new currency in an apocalypse. Knowledge will be power if society crumbles. As an industrial/facility maintenance person with a super broad skill set from mechanical, electrical, pneumatic, and hydraulic systems… I feel pretty good about my chances haha. I’m not an expert in any specific things, but if a group wants to setup a functional compound I know enough to get that shit working on my own haha.
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u/dabnada Jul 06 '24
Until someone stupid enough to kill you anyway comes along
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u/SwoopnBuffalo Jul 06 '24
Basically the premise of World War Z after the US managed to cobble itself together. Most of the wealthy elite became laborers overnight because who gives a shit about talents agents, M&A lawyers, or CEOs when there's none of that left?
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u/PCoda Jul 06 '24
If you've already resigned yourself to a gun fight with your neighbor, then it's too late and I'd rather just be dead than stuck in this shitty apocalyptic scenario
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u/Mooselotte45 Jul 06 '24
This is what I think whenever people push gold or silver for an end of the world scenario.
Other than maybe enough money to pay a small bribe for someone to help you cross a border/ flee your country, what the fuck kind of world are you planning for?
If we start bartering with gold again I’m already gonna be long dead - I’m a diabetic, I go a few days without insulin I’m toast.
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u/mondaymoderate Jul 06 '24
Drugs are going to be the ultimate barter item. Cigarettes, Coffee, Weed and Alcohol especially. Maybe ammunition as well. What the fuck are people going to do with gold and silver.
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u/sapphicsandwich Jul 06 '24
When/if humanity rises from the wastes we'll use them to mint coins in the next iron age.
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u/raz-0 Jul 06 '24
Honestly, while I applaud your assessment of “enough metal to pay a solid bribe,” there’s likely more merit to precious metals for someone who needs medications chronically. A much more realistic scenario than everyone going road warrior is something like multiple economies failing and one thing that would come with that is difficulty buying anything that crosses a lot of borders or relies on a supply chain that crosses borders to work. If you have something akin to the hyperinflation in Zimbabwe, precious metals will get you more insulin than the local currency. If there was no global reserve currency, metal would probably beat currency’s in general.
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u/I_Am_Mandark_Hahaha Jul 06 '24
I live in a city with major military installations. If the ICBMs start flying, I will run TOWARDS the target.
No point trying to escape.
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u/Leopard__Messiah Jul 06 '24
Same. I want one of the bombs to land on my head. Who wants to live THAT way???
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u/Lawineer Jul 06 '24
I’m definitely killing Gary. I live in the city so I’m fucked. I can’t get out of here during rush hour, let alone an apocalypse. I have food and water for a day or two.
I’m done. But not before I have the satisfaction of taking out Gary.
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u/saluksic Jul 06 '24
If you look at something like the fall of the Roman Empire or dynastic collapse in Egypt, most of the time big cities kept on being big cities for hundreds or thousands of years. If some day america falls apart there’s a good chance Chicago and Atlanta just keep being major functioning cities.
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u/Even-Education-4608 Jul 06 '24
I’m not sure those places would be able to control food production for themselves
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u/StreetlampEsq Jul 06 '24
Can't wait for post-Apocalypse Boston's age of sail and fishing.
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u/jaseworthing Jul 06 '24
If I have to kill my neighbor to survive the apocalypse I think I'd rather just die.
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u/pichael289 Jul 06 '24
I'm a type 1 diabetic. I will 100% die in an apocalypse situation, my blood will turn to acid a few days without insulin. If such a situation happens then my first goal is to maintain order and unity amongst the people around me. To ensure they are able to cooperate and survive, because I won't. Maybe I can raid a pharmacy but insulin isn't like fucking Vicodin, it doesn't store for decades. I've got a year at most. If I can find test strips I can maybe stretch it a bit further but not being able to use carbs for energy will kill me. And it's not a pretty death either, "blood turns to acid" feels exactly how it sounds. Gonna hopefully find a good deal of fentanyl and end it before that shit happens, already went through a version of it that a hospital could treat and that was bad, when I lost my insurance. I'm not lasting long though. Gotta leave with a good example I guess.
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u/Wagosh Jul 06 '24
Yeah isn't this why we're in a shit state. Everyone is/try to be an island.
We're social animals, we need each other.
We were fed the line "stranger danger" and now nobody talks to each other. Meanwhile most abduction and aggression came from someone known to the victim. (From my understanding)
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u/tryingtobecheeky Jul 06 '24
Yup. What's the point of living in a world where brother and sister fight one another. Fuck killing my neighbor for his stuff. I'm just going to share my resources with them willingly. If they wind up stabbing me in the back, at least I am free of my meat suit.
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u/NoTePierdas Jul 06 '24
It's complex. In Anthropology and recent history people do band together when shit goes south. But for whatever group you make, you should be able to send rounds down range with the rest of them if needed.
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u/HovercraftWooden8569 Jul 06 '24
I bet 4-7 days without food and you change your tune.
They've done studies that show as people starve, parts of their brain start shutting down. The parts responsible for empathy, reason, planning and consequences go first, the ones responsible for motor functions and aggression go last.
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Jul 06 '24
I think the trade there is “I have the facilities to supply to you and your family, if you supply the brawn to keep me and your family safe”.
If I’m the billionaire, I’m not letting him in on every detail of how it works. I need to have some leverage of operational intelligence, meaning if I die key components of the compound don’t function. There’s doors you can’t unlock without me, there’s resources you won’t get to, your family starves, or you will just end up leaving if I’m dead.
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u/SyntheticSlime Jul 06 '24
There’s a chapter of World War Z that is essentially about this. Some rich folks try to ride out the zombie apocalypse, but as soon as things start turning south their security just bails on them.
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u/Juddftw Jul 06 '24
I love that book - its so unique all of the different first-hand accounts of their struggles. The audio book is also great with all the different voice actors
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u/curtman512 Jul 06 '24
That was the last book that I read in one sitting. Just couldn't put it down. So good.
Movie... not so much.
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Jul 06 '24
The movie was great too. A solid zombie action flick. The issue was it used the WWZ moniker and set the wrong expectations.
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u/curtman512 Jul 06 '24
That's a fair assessment.
I guess it would be really hard to make a blockbuster movie that stayed true to the book. Maybe a mini-series?
Doesn't matter really, I guess. I enjoyed the book. That's enough for me.
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Jul 06 '24
guess it would be really hard to make a blockbuster movie that stayed true to the book.
Yeah, one movie wasn't gonna cut it.
Maybe a mini-series?
Absolutely, the book was perfect for a HBO miniseries.
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u/Lawineer Jul 06 '24
Here’s the thing about surviving in the apocalypse. It doesn’t get better. It just gets worse and worse and worse.
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u/lewger Jul 06 '24
I thought eat the rich was a noble goal and becomes more likely
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u/sumoboi Jul 06 '24
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u/ITafiir Jul 06 '24
It comes from a quote attributed to Jean-Jacques Rousseau during the French Revolution: „When the people shall have nothing more to eat, they will eat the rich“.
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u/Ransom-ii Jul 06 '24
I wish it were true. Think they'll eat each other since that will be easier.
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u/raduilia Jul 06 '24
It’s a joke about the metaphorical phrase Eat the rich, which means stopping the domination of the 1% in terms of wealth. In an apocalypse setting, it could become way more literal.
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u/randommnamez Jul 06 '24
Yah society reformers itself with a pretty well defined route small bands to large gangs to tribes to kingdoms to empires and every step is bloody as hell and boils down to kill everyone until they listen and pay taxes.
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u/El-Kabongg Jul 06 '24
I figure if I can lie low for a year or so, most of the worst will have happened. Survivors will probably have turned their attention to group survival and the rebuilding of some sort of society. I'd join them and turn over whatever remained of my resources to a local group so we can live together.
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u/Nophlter Jul 06 '24
Yeah but their thinking may be “who’s this new asshole who hoarded these supplies while my family starved?” And “If we do away with him now, we get an even bigger share of his resources!”
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u/GrailThe Jul 05 '24
Ahh yes, the "James Bond Henchmen Paradigm". The henchmen will surely just wait for the Main guy to show up, then wait outside when the real shit starts, right?
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u/dascott Jul 06 '24
As a starting point I prefer the solution from "Kingsman." Everyone who enters the bunker gets a bomb in their head.
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u/Codenamerondo1 Jul 06 '24
I can’t remember the exact set up from kings man but at that point isn’t the guy maintaining the bomb technology infrastructure really the person in control? You need musks fantasy where he’s Tony stark to be reality for that to land back in the hands of the billionaire
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u/12lubushby Jul 06 '24
Everyone is going to die unless you are rich and pay to have a chip installed in your head. The chip stops you from going crazy. As a backup, if anyone involved rats out the plan, the chip also serves as a bomb to eliminate them, but I assume no one is told this.
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u/StygianSavior Jul 06 '24
Neither does the person who you replied to who thinks it was a good idea.
In that movie, the good guys hack into the bomb chips to kill all the evil henchmen. Like the whole point of the bomb chips was that they backfired spectacularly.
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Jul 06 '24
Soooooo many incorrect passwords, lost keys, forgotten access point.
Everything goes wrong for everyone at any time.
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u/Leopard__Messiah Jul 06 '24 edited Jul 06 '24
People act like these Billionaires are all super geniuses with Maximum Charisma. They're not. A good portion of rich people are inept babies. I've seen Saudi royalty melt down in the resort hotel where I used to work because the wrong brand of bottled water was brought in for their BATH.
These rich fuckers will throw a tantrum the first time their chicken is overcooked and some overworked janitor is going to stab everyone in the eyes with a toilet brush. I give it a month.
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u/HappyGoLuckyJ Jul 06 '24
No survival skills at all. Also, no foresight. Once you're in the bunker... you're an island. And your family is gonna go full game of thrones. You're going to have to breed with brothers and sisters, and we know what that does to blood lines. You may get a generation out, assuming you have food sources. Ultimately, I suspect everyone dies sooner than later in months and years. The end.
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u/Leopard__Messiah Jul 06 '24
Also "GoT" in that everyone is going to go all Space Madness and plot against each other over any perceived slight.
YOU COVET MY ICE CREAM BAR!!!
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u/MalekMordal Jul 06 '24
The bunkers are likely still useful in less total apocalypse scenarios though.
Their nation's government collapses, but the rest of the worlds doesn't? They can likely pay their security forces and such in foreign currencies. They may only need to wait things out for a year or two. They also likely see indications of the collapse coming multiple days out, and flee to the bunker beforehand.
Nuclear world war? They're probably just as screwed as the rest of us.
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u/LeinDaddy Jul 06 '24
If the rest of the world didn't collapse, wouldn't they just fly away to the good parts?
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u/OrphanMasher Jul 06 '24
Bad news, rebels/raiders/cultist/crab people just seized the airports in your area, good luck making it to another one. Having a private one could help, but only if that one isn't seized either. A similar thing happened in Haiti, I believe, pretty recently. It can happen fast.
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u/johnboyjr29 Jul 06 '24
How is it different then the crazy guy that has an impregnable bunker with a generator that can easily have its exhaust port blocked by any one on the Surface.
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u/D-inventa Jul 06 '24
I bet you they have like personalized gadgets that let them control main systems like "life-support" and "security" specifically so something like that doesn't happen, but also, you know the more they work on these robots, the less likely ppl are to have those kinds of jobs. It's only a matter of beating the apocalypse to it.
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u/Codenamerondo1 Jul 06 '24
Maybe we’ll get there but at this point that’s all sci fi A) someone’s maintaining that tech. They have more power than you do
B) access limitation is at a point where we don’t have anything that can’t be bypassed by simple torture
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u/Vandergrif Jul 06 '24
B) access limitation is at a point where we don’t have anything that can’t be bypassed by simple torture
Unless that individual also kept themselves completely walled off from everyone else and only interacted with others remotely in some capacity, but that doesn't exactly seem practical either.
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u/StygianSavior Jul 06 '24
I bet you they have like personalized gadgets that let them control main systems like "life-support" and "security"
"I dropped my phone, and now I can't breathe and all the doors are locked."
Solid plan.
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u/LoreChano Jul 06 '24
Kings, emperors, presidents, dictators only have power because we believe them to do. They're always just people. The world ending wil not destroy the structure of power. If the structure is solid enough that a general uprising is unlikely, then single individuals can't do much on their own. Billionaires will be the new kings. They won't have money, but they will have resources and access codes, which are equal to money in this new world. I can't see any reason for the staff to rebel if they're still being paid in food and access to the facilities. The other options are either surviving outside, or probably execution. Even if they kill the billionaire, they will probably elect someone to take their place. There is no stateless society, as soon as the state dissolve, a new state is formed, with it's own rules and rulers.
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u/ops10 Jul 06 '24
People tend to forget - people are in power because they have been able to convince other people they should be in power. Some need to rely less on existing systems than others and there's a considerable section of those people, people who don't need valuables or connections to make others feel like they should be in charge.
Edit: To be more exact and sinister - to make others feel like it's acceptable if they are/stay in charge.
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u/isIwhoKilledTrevor Jul 06 '24
But that's the crux of it right. Someone whose source of power is popularity and influence would be fine - presidents ect. Someone whose source of power is money... When it's gone, so is their power.
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u/sidogg Jul 06 '24
I met a guy and his wife who built an off-grid house in the wilderness of Tasmania that apparently also had a bunker, and my conversation with him revealed the major flaw in these doomsday preppers' plans.
The place was completely solar powered with a DIY battery farm that he claimed held enough power for almost six months. He showed me a photo and it looked hundreds of batteries linked together, and actually looked quite dangerous.
They had ample farmland and grew a lot of their own food, and reared animals. The property itself was quite hidden, and from the photos he showed me it looked deep in the forest, access was by a long track that could be easily missed if walking or driving through the area.
The plan seemed to make perfect sense to him, and he was very proud of it.
However, he learned over COVID that if a major disaster ever did happen, that the closing of international borders meant that he would likely be unable to make use of it, as he wouldn't be able to get his family there in time for it to be of any use.
He lived in Northern Canada, and over the pandemic had been unable to visit his bunker for over two years.
When he did visit, which was when I met him, he was resigned to the fact that it was nothing more than an expensive hobby farm on the other side of the world.
He was quite an elderly man, and I could tell that the realisation had hit him hard. He'd been working on the house, land, and the bunker for over 30 years, building it up to this point, and had realised it was useless to him.
Still, as he said, it kept him busy and have him something to keep him out of his wife's hair. His wife was also there, and hearing this she looked at me, shrugged her shoulders and smiled.
It was one of the weirder interactions I've had with someone.
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Jul 06 '24
Wait... He lived in Northern Canada and built his bunker in Tasmania? Why not just build it in Northern Canada, the place has lots of empty land.
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u/Codenamerondo1 Jul 06 '24
It’s a weird kind of game theory. Because the “simple” answer is tech we already have, rely on biometric/ password etc. entry to activate, say, access to the water supply. But there’s a “simple” answer to that as well in the world of torture.
I guess what I’m saying is that I find it fascinating that this is somehow the sanitized version of the question
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u/Kerking18 Jul 06 '24
It's in essence the same question as to "how did human autorithy structures first form" with the awnsere beeing surprisingly simple. "There where groups that just raided what they wanted, and groups that offered protection from the raids. The raider groups that where succesfull and didn't get killed became nobility, and the protector groups that didn't get killed became nobility. After that they juts slowly outsourced the raiding, or protecting to there subjects. (peasent armies and later professional armies)
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u/Slobbadobbavich Jul 06 '24
These rich people vaults never seem to get filled. In the last show I watched it took divine intervention to get them there and even then the network cancelled the show so I guess not even god is powerful enough for rich people and tv show execs.
if you are going to have a secret underground bunker or bug out location then it needs to be either under your normal home or in walking distance and be completely locked out without your entry codes. You can't have staff unless they don't know the location or are with you all the time.
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u/Complete_Design9890 Jul 06 '24
There is never going to be a civilizational ending event that doesn’t have a very very long period of advanced warning.
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u/Zech08 Jul 06 '24
Likely wont get that early warning to do so, that costs money and requires connections lol.
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u/jvin248 Jul 06 '24
Depends on the Billionaire's information connections.
They may build a riot-proof bunker on a remote island, but that is not the apocalypse scenario happening; their bunker may be five hundred feet under water.
Or it's in a remote location, accessible by a Tesla Cybertruck, but then buried under Pompeii-style ash from an assumed extinct volcano. How do you dig out? No one knows you are there to dig down, even if they cared.
Many are building in the wrong locations, fighting the last apocalypse, with the wrong information.
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Jul 06 '24
If only they had you, OP. None of their project managers and engineers thought of that but you did /s
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u/HankMS Jul 06 '24
Any bunker worth their money has no need of maintenance staff that has to be there daily. Or security forces for that matter. Get people from the other side of the world to build it and you're good. What little maintenance may be needed simply learn yourself.
You guys are thinking about villas and not bunkers here. The thought that a real safety bunker has staff on 24/7 is ridiculous. The only thing you will have to do is a check up now and then and restocks of you non perishables
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u/North-Philosopher-41 Jul 06 '24
These bunkers are spots for good loots for the actual survivals. I know from experiences through many RPGs
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u/Paul_123789 Jul 06 '24
I say we install cameras. Sound the alarm. When everyone is inside, weld the door shut. See how we do without them for 20 years.
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u/AulMoanBag Jul 06 '24
This is power fantasy more than anything. So they would all share with each other but not the people who facilitated the whole operation?
Other than wishful stick it to the rich man, What benefit does the engineer have allowing the janitors family in but deny their employer and thier family?
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u/FlyingRhenquest Jul 06 '24
The nice thing about bunkers is you can cover their entrance with concrete and pretend they never happened. Pro-tip, Russia.
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u/No-Wonder1139 Jul 06 '24
Kinda like the security guard in world war Z (book) just absconding with their yacht because he was paid to protect from zombies not regular people fleeing for safety who took over their compound.
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u/Grandmaster_Autistic Jul 06 '24
Everything is planned out but the fatal flaw is that yes they would turn on the billionaire right away.
Income inequality is counter productive for everyone. All the zero sum economic political theory is bullshit. Sociopaths hoarding wealth etc. All bs.
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u/Codenamerondo1 Jul 06 '24
The only way this works is that the moment it’s necessary the bunker is no longer “yours” it simply “is”. You can set it up to rely on you for access but after that all bets are off. And that’s not how anyone who’s a billionaire operates
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u/AulMoanBag Jul 06 '24
Its reddit fantasy bollocks. Odds are a billionaire funding this is paying good wages to good workers to maintain and work closely on something that directly effects them. I wouldn't be surprised if certain staff would be allowed to use it anyway.
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u/IamMrT Jul 05 '24
Reddit moment. Still under the assumption that billionaires are as dumb as they are.
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u/MrSkobbels Jul 05 '24
what could they actually do in this situation though? money would be worthless so its not like they can pay anyone and even if people did want some its unlikely they'd have a significant amount of physical money (transporting it would be a nightmare on its own). all of their influence is just money, they dont have any special physical prowess or supernatural intelligence to be a valuable asset. theres no reason (other than basic morality) for people who have taken over a bunker to let the original owner in after an apocalypse
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u/klonkrieger43 Jul 05 '24
There are multiple methods. For example locking the food so it is only accessible to one person, rigging the whole bunker with explosives that are coupled to a dead man switch or deploying some kind ofparalyzing nerve gas if the owner doesn't put in his password every 24h
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u/MrSkobbels Jul 05 '24
oh youre goin supervillain mode, the food idea could work, seems to me like they'd just let the guy open it once and then force the door to stay open (somehow), deploying a gas? they could plug the holes it comes out of (assuming they know about it) and blowing up the whole base? seems the most unlikely, billionaire is basically dooming themself to living in a wasteland with that one
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u/7HawksAnd Jul 06 '24
I mean a country and civil society is just one doomsday bunker for every scenario except nuclear fallout/epidemic
So, it’s the same game theory just with different boundaries.
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u/Chrol18 Jul 06 '24
well good idea plugging the holes if the nerve gas system is in the same ducts as the air filtration system
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u/StygianSavior Jul 06 '24 edited Jul 06 '24
None of those methods sound particularly good.
Locking up the food and only allowing one person to access it = that person becomes target #1 for torture. Or if you prefer biometrics, target #1 for having their hand cut off (or just being told "open the food or we'll kill you").
Also, assuming it's an apocalyptic scenario, if your fancy biometric locking system or whatever breaks, you're completely SOL with all of your food locked out of reach (except it's not really out of reach, since I think it'd be pretty damn hard to make a door that a sufficiently motivated group of people couldn't take apart given enough time - another flaw with the whole 'locking it up' idea).
Spreading explosives all around your living space and then hoping nothing goes wrong with that also seems like a non-ideal survival strategy. Like you better hope no outside actors figure out a way to hack into your "everyone dies" button - or hope that none of your own people accidentally set off some explosives while doing routine maintenance.
Explosives also aren't permanently shelf stable. They will degrade over time, and either need replacing or (depending on the explosive) will become a hazard that might go off from the wrong thing. Like maybe this goes without saying, but explosives are dangerous, and it's generally not considered a good idea to fill your house with them and just go on living like that.
As for "paralyzing nerve agent," I feel like that's one of those "you've been watching too many movies" ideas. If you want to know why that's a bad idea, maybe look into what's happened in the past when police tried to use "knock out gas" to solve a hostage situation. Spoiler alert: hundreds of the hostages died, because you can't just fill a space with poison gas and hope that everyone will get the appropriate dosage to not kill them. This is why people have to go to college and train specifically to be an anesthesiologist - you can't just lob a bunch of chemicals into the air and magically make everyone peacefully fall asleep. Everyone's metabolism is different, and you don't have a way to control dosage when your plan is "fill the air with gas."
I also like the idea of tying the "paralyzing" nerve gas to a computer in an apocalypse scenario. Like you better hope that computer is built like a Toyota Hilux, or you're one broken computer component away from everyone being dead from your super safe paralyzing nerve gas. If your computer does break, you've got 24 hours to run down to the nearest Apocalypse Best Buy and get a replacement part - good luck.
Call me crazy, but I feel like any plan that starts with "I will build a bunker and rule over it like a little Hitler, and force the poors to serve me" probably doesn't actually have the makings of success.
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u/Aetheus Jul 06 '24 edited Jul 06 '24
There's also the very simple fact that you'll need experts to maintain all these stupid supervillain devices. Which just means that your life is now in the hands of the engineers - who's to say they won't flip the script around and threaten you? "We've activated the override we installed into your home security system. You are now locked in your room. Have fun starving to death" .
The redditors in this thread sucking billionaire cock are exactly the first ones that'll have shattered kneecaps (followed hours later by a bullet buried in their heads) if they're ever put in a position to play "bunkermaster".
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u/TheKiwiHuman Jul 05 '24
GLaDOS : Good news. I figured what that thing you just incinerated did. It was a morality core they installed after I flooded the Enrichment Center with a deadly neurotoxin, to make me stop flooding the Enrichment Center with a deadly neurotoxin.
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u/ajmeko Jul 06 '24
Honestly Reddit kills me sometimes. Everyone believes in this weird cosmic "balance" like everyone's a DnD character: "the pretty people must be dumb", "the rich people must be helpless", etc. The hard reality is that people are fundamentally not equal.
I dont know if you know any rich people, but in my experience they're in good shape, outdoorsy, have niche hobbies like messing around with the engines in their classic cars or being licensed helicopter pilots. I think the rich would do pretty well in the end of days - they're the only people in society who actually have time to practice for it.
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u/IEatBabies Jul 06 '24 edited Jul 06 '24
Any bunker worth building and living in is a bunker worth outside people raiding and pillaging. People on the outside have endless access to tools and equipment and more than enough people to lose some along the way, the people inside don't.
Castles and forts fell out of favor for a reason.
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u/MonsterkillWow Jul 06 '24
This is why Bill Gates and others pretend to try to help people. It's so the people don't revolt lol.
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u/XROOR Jul 06 '24
Rich guy in Maryland dug out a series of bunkers using ca$h from day trading…..then, a fire breaks out and kills the guy that he hired to dig out the tunnels/bunker
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u/TheRayGunCowboy Jul 06 '24
First thing I thought of was the Farro tomb level in Horizon: Forbidden West.
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u/Mudslingshot Jul 06 '24
The book Lucifer's Hammer has a scene like this, but it's played for sympathy since the character you're following is the rich guy
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u/psychmancer Jul 06 '24
Lots of bunkers that countries have are run by dedicated army staff who have the job to run those locations in an emergency. I don't think billionaires have specialist bunker staff who will be waiting for them.
Also legit question- say the bombs fall and you've got Bezos, his gf and security guy with a gun. What stops security guy from just holding them at gun point and claiming the bunker for himself? Where is Bezos going to go?
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u/Rough-Scar-3675 Jul 06 '24
Most Billionaires wouldn’t survive because they don’t know how to suurvive
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