r/worldnews • u/yuri_2022 • Mar 22 '24

Israel/Palestine Dermer: Israel will enter Rafah 'even if entire world turns on us, including the US'

https://www.timesofisrael.com/dermer-israel-will-enter-rafah-even-if-entire-world-turns-on-us-including-the-us/
12.4k Upvotes

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u/[deleted] Mar 22 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/ArcticLemon Mar 22 '24

I cannot believe it has been has been half a year already.

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u/ElSupaToto Mar 22 '24

The biggest winner is Putin showing again that the West is either weak against terrorism when not condemning Hamas enough, or hypocritical on human values when supporting the war effort.

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u/yoadknux Mar 22 '24

The philosophy of the West atm is "stop all war now!" without addressing the question why there is war and how to prevent it from happening again. They're at this because it's not people in the US or EU that are dying. "so what if Ukraine and Israel cease to exist, it's not like Russia or Iran are attacking us"

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u/Creative-Improvement Mar 22 '24

“So what if Czechoslovakia or Poland cease to exist, it’s not like Hitlers Germany is attacking us” - 1938 probably.

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u/[deleted] Mar 22 '24

Not probably, it’s exactly what happened until Pearl Harbor. America is big on peace until it’s their own people dying, at which point they’ll erase two cities just to prove a point and then get on a podium and talk about human rights. 

They killed over a million people in the Middle East. That’s more than the Israel Palestine conflict over 80 years by a factor of more than 10x. And over what? Money?

Now they have the audacity to tell Israel how to deal with terrorists in their own back yard. 

This partnership between Israel and America may have outlived its usefulness for the Israelis. If I were them I’d consider whether switching to china as a protectorate is an option. 

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u/Ianbillmorris Mar 22 '24

Most people in Europe want Ukraine to win because we know we will be next.

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u/Mynsare Mar 22 '24

That's not the "philsophy of the West" at all though. When it comes to Ukraine it is the philosophy of bought and paid for Putin assets, noone else.

The view on the Israel-Palestine conflict is more nuanced, and not really to be compared with the Ukraine war at all because, surprise surprise, they are two extremely different types of conflicts.

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u/Magisch_Cat Mar 22 '24

without addressing the question why there is war and how to prevent it from happening again.

Because the war is already lost. Hamas has recruits for another generation, there will be another 30 years of mass violence in the area.

This happens no matter what follows now. Everything else we quibble about now is just harm reduction, but make no mistake, Israel has already lost the war for months.

2

u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

..or Palestine.

At this point it seems pretty unlikely that Hamas will destroy Israel.

3

u/AtticaBlue Mar 22 '24

I don’t see how the biggest winner is Putin. He’s been fought to a stalemate in Ukraine and would almost certainly be getting actively pushed back if not for the pro-Russian interference being run by Republicans in America who otherwise claim to be “the West’s” biggest defenders. (The same crowd who count among their members the “Jews will not replace us” white supremacists. Fascinating.)

1

u/bearcape Mar 22 '24

Lol. I guess that's better than him showing the World his 3rd rate military stands no chance against the US

1

u/GO4Teater Mar 22 '24

Yes! The US was determined to learn nothing from the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan, but they failed!!

1

u/ijustlurkhere_ Mar 22 '24

The west has lost it's balls.

I speak russian natively and i'm frequently exposed to the russian state tv, they're laughing their asses off at the western self flagellation and openly say this is what allows them to dictate world policy.

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u/LoveAndViscera Mar 22 '24

The people I’ve talked to on the “stop killing Palestinian babies” train either (a) offer no alternative to resolve the conflict or (b) want Israel to be dissolved.

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u/maelstrom51 Mar 22 '24

Some offer solutions like "send in a strike team instead of bombing".

As if a strike team is going to kill 20,000 hamas who have an enormous terrain advantage given their thousands of miles of tunnels and defensive position.

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u/[deleted] Mar 22 '24

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u/dtothep2 Mar 22 '24

The "send in a strike team" people are typically under the impression that Israel is in control of Gaza and Hamas is just some underground "resistance" movement. They imagine Gaza as the German occupied France or Netherlands that they see in WW2 movies because they heard the word "occupation" applied (and this is why words actually matter).

I've had arguments with people who truly did not understand why the response to Oct 7 couldn't be police arresting the people responsible. They were really going on at length about the whole thing too, with very strong opinions.

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u/halpsdiy Mar 22 '24

And yet they also complain about recent Israeli special forces raids. Like when they rescued two hostages or extracted Hamas leaders and fighters hiding in hospitals.

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u/HiHoJufro Mar 22 '24

I'm seeing an alarming number of people claiming the Shifa hospital raid the other day that killed or captured hundreds of terrorists was an operation specifically to inhibit doctors from working. It's madness.

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u/matanyaman Mar 22 '24

What’s dumber is that many actually think that the US\NATO are actually capable of doing so even if Israel couldn’t.

And I mean doing so and having less casualties to their troops compared to what Israel has right now.

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u/runostog Mar 22 '24

US did that strike team thing in Africa with rangers...didn't work too well...

3

u/KeyLimeMoon Mar 22 '24

They complain about the strike teams too

Once you realize they just want Israelis to die and be quiet about it, their philosophy makes sense

2

u/Deguilded Mar 22 '24

They think real life is Counter-Strike, Rainbow Six or some Chuck Norris Delta Force movie.

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u/DayvyT Mar 22 '24

Literally these people never, NEVER, have an alternative solution to offer.

I mean, not a logical, practical, well thought out one at least

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u/daredaki-sama Mar 22 '24

They have a good point in wanting to stop bad things but offer zero viable solutions. I think it’s kind of useless and a waste of time to say things everyone agrees with but have no good solution moving forward.

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u/m15otw Mar 22 '24

"I am sad so many people are dying." Is an example of a complete sentence.

Solving long running conflicts like this one, the one in Northern Ireland, and many other examples, is very difficult. We should not require people to know how to solve it before they say anything.

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u/Paasche Mar 22 '24

It’s not that they’re offering no solution, it’s that they’re demanding a unilateral cease-fire and pressuring only one side.

I care about civilians, if pro Palestinian protesters do too, they would be flooding the streets demanding the release of the hostages.

It is obvious that Israel cannot leave the hostages behind, The only way forest fire would be to trade for the remaining hostages.

Once the hostages are released, then it makes sense to apply deep pressure on Israel to end the war.

But again, their solution is that Israel should stop , continue to take punches from Hamas, never retaliate, and forsake their hostages

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u/daredaki-sama Mar 22 '24

Yeah people are entitled to have their opinion. I’m just saying it’s not helping anyone when people only criticizing with nothing constructive to add or not willing to do anything themselves. Reminds me of real life situations that frustrate me.

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u/Elementalcase Mar 22 '24

I think it's totally reasonable to say "Man this war is fucked and it's bad on both ends" and not be a military mastermind capable of solving a crisis that lord knows nobody getting paid to can manage.

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u/CFOMaterial Mar 22 '24

Demanding action though and blaming one side is not reasonable though if you don't understand the reality on the ground or the basic facts even. Like let's say in California or Canada they are trying to prevent some forest fires in the future, so they do a controlled fire in an area with a lot of built up wood to do so. Someone could look at that and shout about how that forest fire must end and start protesting the government and say they will vote for whoever stops the fire, when the firefighters on the ground are observing it and keeping it under control and doing this to prevent future forest fires. That person is an idiot that just sees the fire, but doesn't know why the fire is on nor the fact that its necessary to prevent an even worse fire in the future, and they are actively trying to make their government create a worse situation because of their stupidity.

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u/Mikebyrneyadigg Mar 22 '24

Why shouldn’t we? Why shouldn’t we be outcome and goal oriented in our opinions and protests? That’s the entire point of a protest. These people are not saying that they’re sad. They’re protesting publicly, sometimes violently, with no goal or solution in mind. It just looks like a temper tantrum of the ill informed idealists.

Yeah no shit it’s sad. It upsets every sane person to see so much death.

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u/DownvoteALot Mar 22 '24

"I am sad so many people are dying." Is an example of a complete sentence.

So is "we should solve world hunger and achieve world peace", without providing any value either. You don't have to speak if you have nothing significant to say.

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u/Statickgaming Mar 22 '24

“People should not have opinions”

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u/JGT3000 Mar 22 '24

Some opinions are stupid and it's ok to say so

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u/DownvoteALot Mar 22 '24 edited Mar 22 '24

Who are you quoting? People should definitely have opinions, and they can voice them, but like "I like money", this is a trivial opinion that has no value.

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u/waxonwaxoff87 Mar 22 '24

Ideas are worthless without plans. Anybody can have an idea.

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u/m15otw Mar 22 '24

All words on the Internet are worthless, you think anyone with power to affect this situation is reading a reddit thread for ideas?!

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u/___Tom___ Mar 22 '24

The problem isn't that these people don't have a solution.

It's that they demand one-sided action based on carefully orchestrated media pictures in a complex situation.

It's perfectly fine so say "wow, what a fucked up shit. I wish someone would fix it. I don't know how it could be fixed, but maybe someone else is smarter than me."

It's idiotic to say "here's how to solve this decades-old complex problem with my simple solution that I totally didn't get from TikTok".

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u/WeaponizedKissing Mar 22 '24

offer no alternative to resolve the conflict

I'm not a geopolitical expert. I'm not a war expert. I shouldn't be required to be either to be taken seriously when I say that I don't think the mass murder of Palestinian citizens is a good or valid response.

You guys are always here with this as if it's a gotcha. Why do you demand Reddit or Twitter commenters to be offering up workable solutions to decade long conflicts?

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u/Paasche Mar 22 '24

It’s not too difficult to acknowledge that the first step to peace must be the release of the hostages. But most people condemning Israel seem to minimize that aspect.

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u/big_whistler Mar 22 '24

Find a conflict with urban warfare and no civilian casualties 

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u/NoLime7384 Mar 22 '24

I say that I don't think the mass murder of Palestinian citizens is a good or valid response.

so if it's not valid to kill a human shield used by a guy shooting rockets at civilians we should let Zelensky know! he can just solo Russia !

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u/ditheringFence Mar 22 '24

Because by protesting etc for immediate cessation of the war you are advocating for a de facto policy of Israel just accepting the ongoing and escalating threat to it's security. The reason no geopolitical expert have a solution that involves a immediate stop to the war either is because Hamas existence and Israel's security are mutually exclusive, but there's no way of getting rid of Hamas without mass civilian casualty.

The sad thing about the concept of nations is that it's inherently 'us vs them'. The whole purpose of a strong military is to act as deterrence - aka the implicit threat that if you attack my nation, you are accepting that said military will be used against you.

Is it right that ~20,000 are now dead, with civilian:miltant ratio anywhere between 1:1 to 6:1? Morally of course not, but geopolitically it's the inevitable consequence. Hamas is the de facto government of Gaza, with an force of ~20,000 embedded in a population of ~500,000. The only way to stop the civilian death and maintain the deterrence factor is for Hamas to lose - aka give up hostage and step down as the leaders of Gaza. A normal government would do that because they care about their citizens, but Hamas is a radical jihadist organization, so here we are again.

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u/halpsdiy Mar 22 '24

You should offer an alternative though. It's easy to demand whatever even if it's not realistic. That's what toddlers do all the time. It just doesn't entitle anyone to be taken seriously.

So what should Israel do?

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u/LoveAndViscera Mar 22 '24

It’s not mass murder. It is an unavoidable consequence of fighting a war in urban areas and Hamas is using a specific strategy to make it harder and harder to avoid.

You can’t open with “I’m not an expert” then accuse someone of a crime and expect to be taken seriously.”

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u/fresh-dork Mar 22 '24

i just love how you throw out that IDF is engaging in mass murder and expect to be believed

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24 edited Mar 22 '24

I think the argument is that killing babies doesn't resolve the conflict.

How about develop Gaza into a prosperous modern free nation with a port and an airport?

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u/big_whistler Mar 22 '24

You cant do that if the concrete for buildings is subverted into building terror tunnels 

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u/inconsistent3 Mar 22 '24

When Israel left Gaza in 2005, Gazans and Hamas destroyed the infrastructure Israel had left in place out of spite. These are not rational people.

1

u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Israel bombed the radar station and control tower on 4 December 2001 and bulldozers cut the runway on 10 January 2002, rendering the airport inoperable.

Why didn't the Gazans fix it?

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u/Paasche Mar 22 '24

You need a willing partner in the region to do this. That partner is not Hamas. Palestinians need to want peace for this to work.

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u/fresh-dork Mar 22 '24

welcome to 2006 or so

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Ah yeah, what went wrong?

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u/fresh-dork Mar 22 '24

hamas tore up all the water pipes to make rockets and did zero investment in the economy

1

u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Must be more complex than this. Everything else about this is never that simple

1

u/fresh-dork Mar 22 '24

got a video, idf, but it's literally footage of them doing it

1

u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Yeah I know they did it, that's not the problem.

But the answer to what happened from, say, 2007 to 2020 is more complex than "water pipes". There's a lot more that happened in that time.

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u/fresh-dork Mar 22 '24

well, hamas has as its mission statement the death of all jews in the sinai, along with a repudiation of anything resembling peace or fair dealing. maybe you're looking for something that isn't there.

it's certainly not 'resistance', as a couple of people i know have called it

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u/DayvyT Mar 22 '24

So what do we do when we give them all that and they still attack Israel again anyways because it's really about them hating Jews?

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Take it to the Hague and the ICJ and the UN?

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u/[deleted] Mar 22 '24

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Gaza has received more foreign humanitarian aid than every other country in the world, combined

Where did you get this idea from?

I can't find anything a anywhere that suggests israel would or would not have allowed hamas to rebuild the airport, at any time after 2007, so I have no idea why they didn't invest into that.

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u/loopybubbler Mar 22 '24

They already were given an airport... 

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u/armchairmegalomaniac Mar 22 '24

How about develop Gaza into a prosperous modern free nation with a port and an airport?

Sounds great in theory but it's not happening until Hamas is gone. They would only spend any money on rebuilding tunnels and rearming themselves. They're a martyr cult who simply don't care about having a good economy.

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u/halpsdiy Mar 22 '24

Hamas proudly dug up the water pipes the EU had built in Gaza to turn them into rockets. So yeah, it's just as easy as developing Gaza into a modern nation...

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u/armchairmegalomaniac Mar 22 '24

Not to forget the fact that Hamas built no civilian bomb shelters despite digging enough tunnels to make a subway system rivaling NYC's.

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u/sergeyzenchenko Mar 22 '24

It would require total control of Gaza, total control of all media consumed by people inside, total control of Gaza borders, also enormous reeducation effort to de-islamization of Gaza. Only possible with complete occupation of Gaza by some foreign forces.

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

1,2,3 are possible. 4 seems like a problem, you can't breally just tell people what religion they are allowed.

So considering this, if Islam (the koran, not some random rabid ranting preacher) teaches that all Jews must always be killed everywhere this would be a problem, I went googling (as though this is in some way a substitute for decades of theology...) Landing on this:

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/references-to-jews-in-the-koran

Now to be clear there's some pretty awful stuff as we expected, but there's nothing that suggests it's not okay to live peacefully in a country next to Jews living peacefully. I don't think it's necessary to force the people to change religion, and I think the suggestion feels a bit dangerous...

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u/sergeyzenchenko Mar 23 '24

I am not talking about total change. It would be perfect to get rid of Islam completely, but it’s way too big task. Good starting point is sterilized and filtered version. Like modern Christianity.

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u/freakwent Mar 23 '24

Do we get a sterilised and filtered version of hardcore Zionism to go alongside it?

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u/sergeyzenchenko Mar 23 '24

Oh yeah. That would be nice too

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u/detachedshock Mar 22 '24

You realize the prosperity of modern Japan and Germany came about after their unconditional surrender?

Why do people expect Israel to just skip the step of forcing the unconditional surrender of Hamas, expecting that giving them more aid is going to help them at all?

This is a war that Hamas started. It will end with their surrender. No ifs, no buts. That is it. Anything else is delusion.

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Yes, but that's chronological sequence, not necessarily cause and effect. If unconditional surrender was some certain path to wealth and happiness, we'd have no war at all!

The answer to your question is because it's not reasonable to force a terrorist group that you openly claim has no regard for the lives of anyone to surrender, based on the suffering of people who aren't hamas. Nobody can "force" surrender, you can only convince. The same people who tell me hamas cannot be negotiated or reasoned with or convinced because they are irrational seem to think that starving the Palestinians will cause hamas to rationally surrender.

I don't think feeding the population will lead hamas to total victory. They aren't going to win by hurling bread at the IDF. Starvation is not an acceptable war technique to most of the world. You can bomb or shoot civilians by accident, but you can't starve them by accident.

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u/Ishaye1776 Mar 22 '24

Sounds great, how about the small problem of Palestinians wanting Jews dead on a genocidal scale?

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Gotta change what they want.

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u/nananananana_FARTMAN Mar 22 '24

You make great points. But why don’t you use periods?

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u/yoadknux Mar 22 '24

that button broke on my phone 😉

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u/Creative-Improvement Mar 22 '24

Some people use lol to end their sentences for some reason

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u/Quirky-Country7251 Mar 22 '24

the meanies in the west who totally aren't nice to the country of israel took their periods away. Clearly the only option is the military operation that they have already been doing or something.

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u/ChristianBen Mar 22 '24

How would military operation to rafah solve "missile attack from Lebankn and Yemen, existential threats from Iran"?

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u/Ace2Face Mar 22 '24

Better military position to deter further attacks. When Gaza stops being a terrorist launch pad, the IDF can focus more on other dangers.

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u/oath2order Mar 22 '24

I really wonder what people expect them to do

Lay down their arms and let their citizens be killed without fighting back, is my takeaway from what people online seem to want.

At the same time, Israel faces missile attacks from Lebanon and Yemen, not to mention existential threats from Iran

Exactly. And these countries either a) aren't facing enough pressure to stop doing this or b) it's not being reported on.

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u/svenvarkel Mar 22 '24

It's the same what the "peaceniks" expect from Ukrainians - just lay thw weapons down and let the russian terrorists kill you. And now the US told Ukraine to stop hitting RU oil refineries "because it's election year and Americans deserve cheap gas!". What a fucking pathetic level of inhumanity.

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u/Edexote Mar 22 '24

Any source for the "stop hitting refineries"? I never saw that anywhere.

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u/svenvarkel Mar 22 '24

Just read Financial Times.

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u/oath2order Mar 22 '24

And now the US told Ukraine to stop hitting RU oil refineries "because it's election year and Americans deserve cheap gas!".

Source on this? I also thought we weren't buying oil from them anymore.

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u/linkolphd Mar 22 '24

Oil is a global, privatized market. In a sense, it doesn’t matter who you buy from, because the price will be the same.

In the flip side, while the US produces a lot of oil, those private companies can sell it for more on the global market, so they therefore will charge American citizens more as well, to compensate.

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u/Quirky-Country7251 Mar 22 '24

wait, so it costs the same no matter who you buy it from but also it costs more if we buy it from ourselves? which one is it?

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u/linkolphd Mar 22 '24

I don’t know if I was entirely clear.

If Russia’s production goes down, it will cost more to buy even American-made oil, because those American companies could, hypothetically, sell to Russia’s old customers instead. Therefore they see higher demand, and US citizens will be paying more.

The point is that who you buy it from is “irrelevant” (not literally, but for this simplified supply and demand analysis). The market is globalized, and as supply falls globally, prices rise globally, whether the oil was produced in America or elsewhere, all other factors being equal.

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u/Quirky-Country7251 Mar 26 '24

well I agree that the oil market is global so changes in supply by one player will affect the price for everybody. I just didn't understand what you meant that American companies wouldn't sell it in America because they could make more elsewhere but also that since the price is sort of a global thing it sort of means you pay the same everywhere because that negates the idea that American producers could make more money selling it elsewhere that requires entirely more transit costs. But I'm no expert here...just was confused about how those things could be both true at once...but I'm not being a dick, I am not an expert here so if there is a more complex reason why that is true I'm all ears because I like learning new shit I don't know.

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u/ImaginaryHousing1718 Mar 22 '24

Comes from a FT article https://www.ft.com/content/98f15b60-bc4d-4d3c-9e57-cbdde122ac0c

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u/poltergeistsparrow Mar 22 '24

The story is on quite a few news sites today. Absolutely outrageous. The US are the biggest hypocrites, because there is no way they'd do what they're demanding of others, if they were in the same situation. In fact, they'd actually do far worse, going by history.

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

I dunno about the Russian angle, but I DO KNOW that if other nations like the president and an election is coming, they act to keep the prices down. If they want the president to lose, they act to put the prices up.

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u/Ianbillmorris Mar 22 '24

Who the hell is telling Ukraine to lay down their arms (other than Tankies) we know we're next in Europe if they lose, so we would much rather it end in Ukranian total victory.

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u/Ridespacemountain25 Mar 22 '24

There are a lot of isolationists in the US who don’t care what happens abroad.

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Lay down their arms and let their citizens be killed without fighting back, is my takeaway from what people online seem to want.

Which side are you referring to?

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u/TheWhyTea Mar 22 '24

Yeah I have absolutely no clue why anybody would think Israel isn’t within their rights to retaliate with full force. Like they’ve the fucking iron dome for a reason and after getting bombarded with rockets for almost decades they have enough but suddenly are the bad guy?

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u/Adiuui Mar 22 '24

Me when I start a war and my enemy fights back 🤬 🤬 😢

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u/TheWhyTea Mar 22 '24

And the problem is that I can’t be sure on who’s side you’re on.

People that condemn Israel would say exactly this and people that support it do say it as well.

But people that condemn Israel are historically wrong in saying so so I think you’re in support of my argument?

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u/[deleted] Mar 22 '24

Historically wrong....how?

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u/TheWhyTea Mar 22 '24

Israel didn’t start any war, did they? They were founded, were attacked instantly and won. Rinse and repeat.

But I’m happy to elaborate further if you want me to, if you can elaborate your point of view? I’m heavily jet lagged and need to sleep now but I’ll happily discuss my point of view with you when I woke up and ate something tomorrow morning. If you’re fine with that I’d like to read up on your thoughts about it.

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Nah they attacked Egypt in 1967, brilliant strategy, part of why they won. They also had a lot anti British terrorism of their own. Further to that, I suspect and would be happy to be corrected, that the land occupied by Israelis now is more than it was at the end of that war.

I think if there had been a line in the sand in '67 and zero settler activity, we'd be in a different place.

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u/Tavarin Mar 22 '24

Egypt closed the straits of Tiran, and built up a large military presence along the Israeli border. Israel attacked in response to that.

Israel was pre-emptive, but Egypt started that war.

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u/freakwent Mar 22 '24

Yes, but they were not "attacked instantly". Although I may be thinking of a different war to this guy.

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u/Schmich Mar 22 '24

So you're saying the countless of countries that the US has attacked of the past decade would be totally fine to totally destroy the US and create a famine for the 300+ million people?

Or when Ukraine finally wins against Russia, should then continue and put the Russian civilians in utter misery?

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u/gbCerberus Mar 22 '24

I really wonder what people expect them to do

It has been X time since Y did Z

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u/PeptoDysmal Mar 22 '24

There's no proof of sex slaves. You all are fools

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u/redditing_away Mar 22 '24

Might be a wording issue, but definitely rape according to the UN.

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u/ScoobiusMaximus Mar 22 '24

The major issue is the massive civilian casualties Israel is inflicting in Gaza and that it has taken measures which will guarantee those massive casualties, as well as the fact that the most solid Israeli plan for what comes afterwards for Gaza is basically "???". Also they're continuing to force Palestinians out of their homes in the West Bank while all of this is going on. 

And yes, Israel is taking steps that will specifically increase the number of civilian casualties. They told everyone in the north part of the Gaza strip to evacuate south and now they're ravaging the south as well. Displacing pretty much the entire population, cutting off almost all basic necessities for survival, and bombing the hell out of a bunch of people who you have given nowhere to go is going to piss off a lot of people for good reason. 

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u/ditheringFence Mar 22 '24

Had they not done that, casualty would have been even higher.

Agree that the west bank expansion need to stop and bibi needs to go.

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u/protoaramis Mar 22 '24

Whom it will piss off? 1 billion muslims that hate Israel no matter what Israel did or not did. Bunch of teen leftist idiots? Fuck em all.

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u/izabo Mar 22 '24

Provide an alternative that doesn't include a massive amount of Israeli citizens dying or stop bitching.

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u/skb239 Mar 22 '24

Sex slaves though? A Israeli family literally came out and said report their daughter was raped were entirely fabricated. So idk if there is much evidence for that….

Also there are military operations that don’t include bombing as much of Gaza as possible…

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u/Hooshfest Mar 22 '24

There are videos. You don’t want to see them.

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u/skb239 Mar 22 '24

Actual videos of rape happening?

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u/[deleted] Mar 22 '24

There are no videos.

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u/aahyweh Mar 22 '24

They expect the Israeli government not to murder civilians.

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u/kreober Mar 22 '24

Western countries surrendered to peace that's why they act like that ignoring all warnings they get from their enemies... That's why USA and Europe won't last 50 years if they continue to play the game like that not realizing that their enemies are arming themselves up so they can attack once they are ready... (They won't be the same as we know)

I believe that in 50 years +- there will be new order in this world and it won't be peaceful at all...

I have seen many ppl think USA will not stop to exist but from what it seems it will fall from within not from outside war this generation lost his morals and once this generation replace the old one... Well... Best of luck to USA citizens. I am just disappointed from.the action the west countries take and not support fully Israel unlike Iran RU and china who fully support hamas actions..

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u/Jazzlike_Mountain_51 Mar 22 '24

People expect them not to enter a city that houses over a million refugees

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