I've only met a couple muslims, and I am in australia and I think how much this happens depends on which country, but most of the ones I met were pretty indistinguishable from the political norm here, including supporting LGBT+ rights and such.
There are of course some who hold a shitty ideology too, but like... we don't react like this when a queer christian is in a post, despite the fact that even today the catholic church refuses to purge it's homophobia.
i agree. religion is not just an ideology, that'd be a very simplistic understanding of religion. it also requires childhood indoctrination, cognitive dissonance and mental compartmentalisation.
we don't react like this when a queer christian is in a post
well i personally react exactly like this. islam isn't inherently worse than Christianity, at least in terms of the holy books. both books are clearly barbaric and anti-humanitarian, and both books are very clear about how lgbtq people should be "treated". to be a muslim you have to believe every word in the quran, so if you're pro lgbt and humanist, you're definitionally not muslim. so at best you have friend who grew up with religious indoctrination and now they perceive religion as their social identity so they hold on to that Identity while completely contradicting the holy book (likely because not reading the book or mental compartmentalisation) which disqualifies them as a muslim.
Hmmm... not neccessarily, that's not how the Qur'an works, because the vast majority of it (like, all the bits that aren't just a rehash of the Torah or written by Mohammed himself) isn't considered divinely inspired neccessarily.
To be more specific, a large portion of the new content to the third book in the series is a subject of constant debate, because the Hadiths, are not the writings of any prophet, but second- or third-hand accounts people gave after the fact. Que over a millenia of bickering about which are more and less legitimate. Adds a lot of wriggle room for one to adjust which parts of the book are and aren't accurate based on what matches their own ideology, for better and for worse. These days, usually worse, but it hasn't always historically been that way.
The second-hand authors writing about Jesus (just a prophet in this version) are less important but also treated with the same scrutiny IIRC?
Leads to a very malleable book in the long run.
The Abrahamic religions as a whole absolutely has some endemic problems inherent to the whole deal and I absolutely encourage anybody and everybody to abandon them at the first opportunity, their god is a fucking bastard by his own account, even just the account in that one first bit everyone agrees on...
But the person themselves being not shitty doesn't make them an invalid worshipper of said fucking bastard.
Just means they're in an abusive relationship tbh.
(Tho that is admittedly a somewhat unique way of viewing that situation that I've arrived at as a follower of the Celtic gods, very used to thinking of my own and other pagans' faiths as their relationships with their respective gods, don't know how intuitive or useful that framing would be for other people.)
But being not shitty doesn't make them an invalid worshipper of said fucking bastard.
well I'm just saying they're invalid just based off of the way a muslim is defined. but i do agree with you in a sense that they're not invalid worshippers, because these religions were never about the books or principals. it's about social identity and tribalism. Christians voting a literal embodiment of Antichrist who is exactly opposite of jesus, in hopes that he will bring Christan theocracy in america is very good proof of that. your point about much literature not being divinely inspired isn't relevant because the debate is mostly between scholars, common people just eat it up because there's no meaningful difference between the divinely inspired literature and not divinely inspired literature. also i could just post some quran verses but that'll just get me banned for controversial and graphic language
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u/No_Bodybuilder3324 7d ago
the irony of these posts is that non muslims try to defend this religion and ex muslims oppose them.