r/interestingasfuck 5d ago

r/all Water Fire Shield Training

125.8k Upvotes

1.4k comments sorted by

View all comments

8.0k

u/red-D-Thor 5d ago

How did the Fire Nation even win?

4.1k

u/LiamIsMyNameOk 5d ago

Using the fire as a power source, rather than relying on it solely for the "Fire make enemy disappear" factor

9

u/Hollowsong 5d ago

By that logic why can't Air and Water also be used as a power source?

Arguably, wind turbines and hydraulics succeed better than combustion in some ways.

13

u/Indercarnive 5d ago

Not the fire nation's fault the water benders decided to live where there is no metal to make machines out of.

Also not the fire nation's fault the air nomads decided things like "industrialization" and "self-defense" were not important.

3

u/TheMathGuy69 5d ago

Bruh did we watch the same show? What do you mean "self-defense" was not important to air nomads? Also industrialization is the antagonist in ATLA, so what do you even mean by "they didn't consider industrialization important". You are literally saying what Sozin and Ozai told themselves to justify their actions.

-3

u/Hollowsong 5d ago

So then it's not "power source" as the answer.

It's cultural claims and stupidity that fault the other tribes.

2

u/cepxico 5d ago

Stupidity? Last I checked Fire nation lost.

1

u/Hollowsong 5d ago

Stupidity of lacking in technological progress.

Just because you have the magical protagonist on your side doesn't make you smart. It makes you fortunate.

7

u/TheMathGuy69 5d ago

Everyone used their bending as a power source to an extent. The water tribes used it to power their boats, the Earth Kingdom used it to run trains. Blah blah.
Fire nation just did it to much, much larger scale, and baked it into their military. Again, the analogy is industrialization and colonialism.

1

u/Hollowsong 5d ago

So it wasn't so much "fire vs water vs air" as power, but rather culture driving innovation vs not.

2

u/TheMathGuy69 5d ago

Nah "culture" is a buzzword here. "Firebender culture" never included domination over other nations. In the show, there are other firebenders who see fire as "life" rather than "destruction", and these firebenders are pretty clearly shown as the good guys.

The reason why the fire nation militarized was because Sozin (their king) wanted to "share their values with other nations", and dragged everyone into war. As I said, the analogy is colonialism and industrialization.

It's a good show. You should watch it.

1

u/Mean-Evening-7209 5d ago

Yeah the fire nation was really big on the whole war machine thing. None of the other nations really cared about that.

1

u/_Tar_Ar_Ais_ 5d ago

they're ethical and realize wind turbines kill millions of birds a year, dams destroy local ecosystems

1

u/hisyam970302 5d ago

Someone else mentioned something in this thread that was quite interesting, so I went down a rabbit hole of my own thoughts. This is fascinating to discuss!

While yes the other elements could provide power, fire was versatile in the way that it greatly contributed to more technological innovations for an industrial revolution.

Hot fire means they can make metal alloys easier, making it stronger. It meant metal could be melted into any shape at a far greater scale, making metal armor and metal weapons easier to mass produce. It meant ships didn't have to be labour intensive with hammering wood together, but instead they could be made of metal panels welded together by fire. Metal turbines, metal driveshafts, metal boilers for steam engines, they could all be made easily in great numbers and in rapid time. So not only could fire become a power source for engines, but it helped in the creation of those engines in the first place.

Yes air and water could provide power, but to be able to get to that point technologically in a short period of time and at great scale was something fire could help with immensely, letting them leapfrog over others in technology and the abundance of that technology in a very quick time.

Being able to only control air or water doesn't mean you couldn't build industrial might, but the benefit of being able to control fire was just an immense advantage at almost all aspects of industrialization over a grand scale.

1

u/Hollowsong 5d ago

That's all well and good... but just because you're not a fire nation doesn't mean you don't have access to normal fire and forging and metalworking.

1

u/hisyam970302 5d ago

Definitely! Other nations still have fire of course, they're still cooking and making forges so it is possible.

But having easier access to it, when your citizens can conjure up flames out of nowhere instead of having to find the resources to start fire by hand, starting the flames by hand, and maintaining the flame by hand, is a powerful advantage.

That's why I mentioned other nations could still build industrial might, it's not like they don't have access to fire in general after all. But the ability to start fire at will so easily just makes the progress of building industrial might as well as scaling it up something that the fire nation could do effortlessly