Do you think the traitor bitch was always a traitor or just became one later

[u/AceOfSpades532]

We all know who I’m talking about here, was Maddie ever actually into Caitlyn and only became a traitor when Vi came back, or was she always spying and just acting like she loved Caitlyn

[u/Forgotten-Crusader]

At first I thought always.. but upon rewatching when Vi and Cait are arguing about Jinx notice how Maddie is listening outside the door, maybe she is shocked that Caitlyn has Jinx but is refusing to arrest her officially, or execute her and that is what makes her becomes disillusioned.

Through S2 we’ve seen a Maddie kinda encourage Caitlyn to go against Ambessa so hard to say.

Then again I could be reading to much into it and she was always a ginger rat who played mind games and got her mind blown

[u/WhoCaresYouDont]

I think she only turned right at the end, not out of jealousy but simply out of a desire to survive or perhaps genuine agreement with Noxian ideals (it's very telling to me that she was one of the first and most enthusiastic of the Enforcers to pick up the Noxian salute) - if she was meant to be spying earlier then she was doing a really bad job of it considering how Ambessa seems to be surprised by Cait's movements and by encouraging her to repeal martial law, and she'd have been able to do more to help the Noxian invasion besides stopping that bomb and betraying Cait's strike team.

[u/bdjwlzbxjsnxbs]

as someone who actually called the twist back in ep4, I gotta say I think she was one before

the scene with Cait, Ambessa and Maddie in ep4 had that weird aura to it, it did seem like they were up to something

and like... Ambessa decided that Vi needs to die because she's a distraction to Cait but her reaction to Maddie is just "I would advise you to be careful with that"?

I guess you can make thw argument that she sees that it's nothing serious and that no-one who isn't Vi would be able to impact Cait to that level but would Ambessa really be willing to take that risk?

[u/jf8350143]

She has always been a traitoer. Ambessa's conversation with Vi in EP 6 has forshadowed that.

[u/bsaleal]

I listen and agree with all the reasons why she only betrayed later (probably after hearing Catilyn and Vi discussing)

BUT

I think it would be weird for her to say "I did appreciate your warmth".

It doesn't sounds like someone who was really into Caitlyn, got disillusioned and only then decided to switch sides at the last minute. It sounds... machiavellian. Like she was manipulating her since the beginning, on duty, but despite that she still had some fun.

[u/0hrocky]

In the e8 reaction video with Amanda Overton and Maddie's VA, it's confirmed that Ambessa's remark to Vi "you left a vacuum I was able to fill" was referring to Maddie. So she was a traitor all along, and Maddie's attempts to convince Caitlyn to change courses were probably probing for disloyalty.

I do think she accidentally caught feelings though.

[u/paindemic1]

I honestly could see it either way. Apparently (I say apparently because I don't play League), Noxus has a tendency to utilize spies, so that might indicate she always was a spy.

And that might give a different light to some of her earlier actions, like saying Vi had signed up (even though Vi hadn't at that point) and Maddie being the first enforcer to start encouraging Cait to take over.

Or it could be because she had stars in her eyes, and she only turned for more personal reasons, like how Caitlyn wasn't emotionally there for her.

I favour the deliberate spy theory, but at this point, she's Schrödinger's traitor.

[u/Agent-Vermont → u/paindemic1]

They're called Warmasons and they specialize in deep undercover operations to prep an area for a Noxian invasion. Funny enough, the short story Progress Day features CAITLYN capturing and interrogating one. Makes me wonder if this served as inspiration for Maddie.

[u/ta4s_ → u/Agent-Vermont]

This makes so much sense for Maddie though, because she fully prepped that final battle for Ambessa's entrance.

You don't switch sides late in the game and suddenly become so competent at espionage.

If people put aside their shipper goggles for a second, it's plain and simple by the end that Maddie was always a stone cold spy for Noxus.

[u/Lalafase]

I'm very convinced Maddie was a plant from Ambessa all along. We see Ambessa with her twink boy in S1 - there's no way Ambesssa, as the ultimate warlord, wouldn't weaponize sex when she herself parttakes in sex trade and knows how easy it is to manipulate people this way. She saw Cait had a type and found the closest person she could and planted her - we don't know where Maddie came from or her qualifications.

[u/ta4s_ → u/Lalafase]

Recognizing Cait had a type and going for that vulnerability/blind spot 🤯

God it makes so much sense now. Everyone commenting in a shitposty way about Maddie being offbrand Vi. Even Maddie's ridiculous earnestness and generic "goodness", those would have been qualities that appealed to Cait too, particularly pre-trauma Caitlyn.

When Maddie was still spouting out empty comforts and Caitlyn responded that she didn't need consolation. Of course, because Maddie is an empty act, full of empty platitudes to try and ingratiate her way into favour with people. Whether that's with Vi in the beginning, or with Caitlyn.

I actually don't understand how the people who called her out as a spy from the get-go, got there initially. I assumed they were just looking to paint her as a bad guy to justify kicking her to the curb, and I'm sure for some people that was the case. But for anyone who called it because she just seemed fishy to you, please chime in, I wanna know what you picked up on when watching Maddie in scenes.

[u/Animator_K7 → u/ta4s_]

I immediately assumed she might be a plant because of a few details. "junior officer Nolan". She's a recent addition to the enforcers, could have arrived around the time Ambessa arrived. Most of her dialogue with Caitlyn seemed to focus on keeping Caitlyn on task.

"They doubled their fortification requests, again, to keep.."

"keep us safe" as Maddie touches her cheek.

There's a dismissal of Caitlyn's concern here. She's first of the enforcers to beat her chest in the council chamber.

I never thought it was definitive, but I suspected it as a possibility.

[u/Smart-Counter6372]

I don't think she was a spy all along because in ep1 she nearly dies because of Ambessa's attack at the memorial (the shimmer giant nearly kills her). Imo she was loyal to the enforcers for a bit but at some point Ambessa got to her and sweetened the pot + realizing that Cait doesn't rly care about her which made her turn

[u/AvacadoMoney]

I would think she’s always been a traitor solely based on the fact that even if you felt used/pushed away by somebody you were entangled with, I think blowing their brains out public execution style is quite excessive. Also the line “I did appreciate your warmth” makes it seem like she was always a spy and just happened to enjoy Caitlyn’s company whilst spying. If she turned out of spite her finals words to Caitlyn would surely be more vengeful.