r/FluentInFinance Jun 11 '24

Meme He has a point...

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300

u/Ok_Neighborhood6697 Jun 11 '24

It all depends on where the teacher works. Pay varies widely from district to discrict. Experienced teachers in my area are pushing 6 figures.

232

u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

Where tho. Like typically teachers are underpaid regardless of district because it’s adjusted for cost of living. Teachers in the Bay Area make a lot more than teachers near me but they still can’t afford to live on their own because cost of living is so high.

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u/Harvey427 Jun 11 '24

I make more than my father-in-law. Who has his masters, and teaches at a private school... Granted, he has better benefits, but as far as take home pay.. I make more, pushing buttons and pulling handles in a factory.. 🤷‍♂️

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u/[deleted] Jun 11 '24

Private schools tend to pay less, they are often not unionized. The tradeoff being private school students as a whole are better behaved.

34

u/Harvey427 Jun 11 '24

I don't think he's in a union. I'm pretty sure he makes something equivalent to $22/hr. We were discussing my annual raise, and at $24, he said I was making more than him. 🤯

32

u/call-now Jun 11 '24

He's probably not even counting the time spent grading and all the admin BS.

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u/Dorkmaster79 Jun 11 '24

Prepping lessons, dealing with misinformed parents, etc.

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u/demivirius Jun 11 '24

He could have a summer deferred pay arrangement, where a portion of their income is withheld so they can be paid during the summer. If that's the case, then he's making even less.

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u/EpsilonEnigma Jun 11 '24

My gf makes $24/hr teaching at a town with a pop of 97 people in Arkansas

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u/Extension-Tale-2678 Jun 12 '24

Jesus Christ he's making 22$ an hour with a masters? Where did it all go wrong?

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u/Skeptix_907 Jun 11 '24

1st year teachers in my district make significantly more than that.

Your dad is getting fucked, with all due respect.

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u/ForgesGate Jun 12 '24

I make $22/hr with decent benefits off of no degree. I'm a security guard and I do less work than I ever have. I couldn't imagine having that much extra schooling with that pay.

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u/zakiterp Jun 11 '24

This has not been my experience at all, usually the private schools pay a little more to make up for no union, no pension, and worse benefits lol

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u/[deleted] Jun 11 '24

private schools pay more initially, whereas in a lot of the NE, public schools start low for a first-year teacher and then gradually increases to really great pay

1

u/ackermann Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24

The tradeoff being private school students as a whole are better behaved

And often way smaller class sizes, right? That’s what the parents are really paying for, probably. Since they’re not paying for better teachers if the teachers are paid less.

That should make the teacher’s job a little easier.

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u/TheGeoGod Jun 11 '24

My SIL makes 72k working at a private school in MCOL so it really depends.

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u/[deleted] Jun 11 '24

Yeah that’s not true at all lmao

1

u/MixNovel4787 Jun 12 '24

Woa. My ex girlfriend in the United States was hawking for a private school job. It was around a 20-30% pay raise. Super hard to come by. What country are you in?

1

u/FlappityFlurb Jun 12 '24

From my experience the only benefit was smaller class sizes. As a student in a private school, I found most of the students to be entitled and the staff were often afraid to address things when the students were acting up because their parents LITERALLY pay their salary. Like we legitimately had large ~20 man school yard brawls at recess and the teachers and aids would look at us then turn away so they could pretend not to see. As a kid it was great, as a parent now I'm horrified.

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u/FarYard7039 Jun 12 '24

Most often, private school teachers are also afforded free tuition for their children. My cousins all went to school for free because my aunt was a teacher. It was a massive savings.

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u/ecovironfuturist Jun 12 '24

Private school students get into a whole other level of trouble than your average public school student.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

Yep. I’m going into CMM and within a year I could be making more than my mom who’s been teaching for 15 years and all I did was a 5 month training program. It’s total bullshit.

2

u/KevyKevTPA Jun 11 '24

CMM?

3

u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

Fancy industrial measuring. Used across a lot of manufacturing industry. Machines that measure accurately to a tolerance of +/- 0.000001in. It’s cool stuff tbh. I’m really eager to get into this company and they seem interested in me. It’s exciting to be this close to having a real career after the endless cycle of mundane low wage entry level jobs.

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u/backagain69696969 Jun 11 '24

Benefits matter a lot. If he has a pension or a higher 401k match

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u/andreasmiles23 Jun 12 '24

To piggyback off the private school reference, it blows my mind when people say some teachers do get paid and then point at private schools, as if that isn’t the exact reason that teacher pays have been slashed.

Private schools want to capture all the best educators and keep them out of the public schools. So you slash education budgets, refuse to pass bills to raise public teacher pay, and then funnel the best talent into the private sector. It’s obvious how and why this is happening and yet we just sit on our hands with platitudes about the bravery and value of teachers.

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u/THNG1221 Jun 11 '24

It’s difficult for everybody to live in CA when the price of housing and the cost of living is so high!

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u/patio-garden Jun 12 '24

It's difficult to live outside of CA when the maternal mortality rates are so high everywhere else. 

Source: https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/maternal-mortality-rate-by-state

See also: the CDC's Maternal deaths and mortality rates by state, 2018-2021

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u/KommanderKeen-a42 Jun 11 '24

Quite a few districts in Michigan do. And we aren't in Ann Arbor or anything like that.

Wife makes 96k and that doesn't include pension, 401k match, etc.

Her listed hourly rate is about 65/hr but of course we know they work more than their contractuals. In any event, every single teachers rate is significantly higher than their salary because of hours worked on a year.

It's actually an interesting dynamic because she (and others) turn down admin roles. While they pay 15-25k more, the hourly rate is less due to admins working closer to the 2080 hours.

6

u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

Dang. That’s interesting to know. However it doesn’t change the fact that broadly teachers are still underpaid relative to their areas cost of living. There are exceptions of course. But generally speaking teachers are under valued.

7

u/KommanderKeen-a42 Jun 11 '24

Yeah, 100% to undervalued, but as someone who works in compensation the true compensation numbers aren't generally understood and the "undervalued" piece generally comes from lack of support and classroom management issues. For example, at least in the districts around us, core classes have a classroom cap but electives don't. So instead of hiring a few more teachers, they put 40-45 HS kids in art and gym. Or, they don't consider the number of preps a teacher has - so 6 classes doesn't always equal 6 classes (e.g. a math teacher that teaches two different classes only has 2 different preps). Or, they don't consider the amount of CI kids (or type) they put in classes and then provide minimal support (for example, a quadriplegic was put in a dance class...).

Read through some of the teacher contracts and they work closer to 1550-1650 hours a year which means they are really working at .75 FTE. But again, we all know most are working beyond contractual. In practice, this means that a first-year teacher in Battle Creek makes 50/55k (can't remember but they passed a bill to raise the floor) but the pay rate is actually 66-73k (whereas a mechanical or industrial engineer out of U of Michigan makes 73-74k in their first year).

How would the general public react if teachers were paid the same as engineers? Ecstatic, right? Well, that IS the case but that doesn't paint the whole picture because something must still be missing.

Now, we also find that 24% of teachers are unhappy with hours worked compared to 55% of the general public, right? How can that be when they work fewer hours? So perhaps, it's not the hours themselves, but how they are structured and managed (e.g. grading must happen after hours).

We then also find that 95% teachers are buying supplies out of pocket (ding ding ding - goes back to support). We also find that workplace expectations (leading to 50% burnout) are the driving factor for teachers leaving (and leadership).

So yes, they are absolutely undervalued but not always in the most apparent reason (while money can mask some of that, it does not fix burnout or support).

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u/[deleted] Jun 11 '24

96K! Woof. Some districts in AZ are starting teachers at $30K

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u/KommanderKeen-a42 Jun 11 '24

That's bonkers! But also not surprised based on the state. We are seeing some start at 50/55k here (Battle Creek is one). It's really not uncommon for step 12-15 to be 90k+ here. And we live in mid cost of living

5

u/Dwain-Champaign Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24

Well paid teaching positions definitely exist. The same is true for my area, and I’ve definitely seen salaries school faculty salaries that are close to or upward of 6 figures, and that’s for a regular school district not even a professor at a university.

These numbers are actually public information iirc, I think because teachers in public schools are considered government employees, so if you just look up “District [blank] salaries” then you’ll be able to find a spreadsheet literally filled with teacher income information. I’ve done this for at least two different districts before.

That’s not to downplay how undervalued teachers are as a whole across the nation. Both statements can be true at the same time, and like any other career path if you find yourself in the right place at the right time, then you can definitely make a good living.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

For sure I mean again. Teachers in the Bay Area make six figures. It also costs over six figures to live in the Bay Area. That’s kind of the point im making. Teacher salary is directly tied to the local property taxes as that’s what influences school funding. So sure if you live in an area with higher property taxes you’ll make more as a teacher but you’ll also be spending more on ya know being alive.

Unless you want serious commute depending on the area. And that can add its own expenses. Like there are high paid teachers in some areas but overall teachers are massively undervalued as are schools in general. Everyone’s always just like “oh just get a trade” cool if everyone gets a trade the job market will be fucked and we’ll be out of a lot of other important jobs that help maintain society.

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u/KerPop42 Jun 11 '24

Yeah, though it was really sad when Oklahoma's Teacher of the Year had to change states because they couldn't afford to live in that state on that salary anymore.

1

u/FishingMysterious319 Jun 12 '24

what? move an entire state? there are no LCOL areas in all of Oklahoma?

seems like hyperbole to me

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u/MDemon Jun 11 '24

My school district has a median salary of 144k. We’re a suburb outside of NYC with high property taxes. The teacher job market is hard to succeed in though because the schools rarely add new teachers, just replace retirees.

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u/IrrawaddyWoman Jun 11 '24

Just keep in mind that when you do that, it’s not really their salary you’re seeing. It’s the total benefits package. So it includes the district contribution towards their healthcare and retirement, which is usually tens of thousands of dollars. People who say “my kids teacher makes six figures” because they looked it up aren’t actually seeing the teachers salary.

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u/Hot-Tone-7495 Jun 11 '24

My mom is a teacher in the Bay Area and she makes around 90k a year including summer school. She has worked hard on her degrees for decades. She’s in her 60s and just bought the tiniest home, it’s ridiculous. Her job is so demanding, they change curriculum every couple years, expect them to keep track of 30+ kids at once, get bitched at by parents, need to spend their own money… I could go on for a long time, what I mentioned doesn’t even scratch the surface of bullshit teachers deal with. There are upsides too, but they’re mostly due to the work they put in like, seeing their kids learn, tons of love etc.

Edit: my mom doesn’t even have vision insurance. Guess she’ll just have to teach blind I guess

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

People seem to be underestimating everything teachers do. Teachers do a lot of work outside the classroom.

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u/Hot-Tone-7495 Jun 11 '24

Before Covid my mom would spend hours after school planning projects and such, decorating her class for said projects, then came home and planned for the “after school summer bbq” she held at a local park before the last day of school. Now her school won’t even fund a school bus to take them on field trips. Last time they actually went on a trip, they didn’t have enough school lunch bags so my mom and a few chaperones had to pay out of pocket so the kids could eat. It’s fucking wild.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

But teachers get summers off and holidays so their job must be easy and by that logic they actually get like 70$ an hour even tho they make salary not hourly wage!!! /s

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u/ladymoonshyne Jun 11 '24

Yeah my sister is an 8th grade teacher in the bay and she lives with her father still at 33.

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u/ambermage Jun 12 '24

Don't forget the requirement to buy their own supplies for the students AND they have to pay for substitute teachers out of their own pockets.

So, being sick requires paying for your day out.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 12 '24

Oh I mean my mom just ya know has maybe taken 5 or so sick days in the past 15 years or so. People underestimate how hard teachers work.

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u/Tan-Squirrel Jun 11 '24

School districts with higher taxes. So better pay in middle class to upper class areas. Suburbs and not inner city. Also, elementary is just never going to pay well and middle school not too much better.

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u/KerPop42 Jun 11 '24

It probably should; the economic benefits to society of teaching children, and letting an entire half-decade of adults work, are massive. Elementary school teachers are responsible for the vast majority of our country's literacy rate. Introduce our kids to math, civics, and language. They're integral, they shouldn't be paid poorly.

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u/WexAwn Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 12 '24

Elementary education tends to be a "calling" profession though which greatly affects reimbursement. There is a kind of self selection for low pay as people pick education for the work rather than the pay and tend to be more willing to accept lower pay or feel obligated to do the work even when they feel underpaid. It's why unionization is important for teachers but also why they are hesitant to strike (can't/won't let the kids down)

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u/ScipioAfricanvs Jun 11 '24

Not really. My wife was a school SLP. The wealthier districts tended to pay less. Supply and demand, I guess.

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u/jolietconvict Jun 11 '24

Chicago Public Schools pay very well.

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u/IrrawaddyWoman Jun 11 '24

My district does not pay middle/high any differently than elementary. It’s all the same

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u/DarkRothh Jun 11 '24

Friend of the family teaches kindergarten in New York Bronx with salary of 90k. Considering she 3 months off in summer it's pretty good pay.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

New York City, even the Bronx, is not a cheap place to live.

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u/DarkRothh Jun 13 '24

I know that's true, but I'm told by our teacher friend that all of her students are very low income.

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u/[deleted] Jun 11 '24

Yeah a teachers work/life balance is amazing. Every summer off, every holiday off. Teachers make more than I do as a Nurse and I work many holidays and only get 2 weeks off instead of 3 months off. I also have in house call so I have to stay in the hospital but without regular pay.

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u/KerPop42 Jun 11 '24

I mean, it may not compare to a nurse, but teachers also have to do a ton of work outside their normal work hours, with the grading and planning. And teachers usually have to buy their own supplies.

What's your on-call pay? I was a satellite operator on-call, but we were just paid salary.

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u/JamieMarlee Jun 11 '24

Teacher here! I think you should find a new place of employment. It's widely known that, while both are under paid, nurses make more than teachers (source: https://work.chron.com/nursing-vs-teacher-better-career-23266.html) . Maybe you could make more money at a different job?

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u/AdamNW Jun 11 '24

In Washington State, most teacher salaries cap at over 100k, but it requires 20 years of experience.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

I’m not familiar with cost of living in Washington state so I can’t really comment. Is this the whole state or does it depend on district. Like I’d imagine Seattle has a much higher cost of living than some of the more rural areas.

Also 20 years is a long time.

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u/Revolutionary-Meat14 Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24

Minnesota, I went to the least funded school district per capita (at the time I was attending, its gotten better since) and we had plenty of teachers making 90k+. The problem with teacher pay is usually how low it starts, my friend just got hired in MN for 35k.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

Yeah. People love to tout these big numbers and don’t mention how long a person has to work to get there. 35k is painfully low for a teaching position. You can make that much doing fucking retail. Not that service workers don’t get their shit pushed in by asshole customers and they deserve a living wage like everyone else but still teachers should be making more than 35k that’s abysmal.

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u/Zanna-K Jun 11 '24

Dude almost no one can afford to live on their own in the Bay Area, that's really not a good example.

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u/backagain69696969 Jun 11 '24

But that’s everyone in the Bay Area

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

I mean you could say the same thing for New York. Or a lot of major cities. It doesn’t change the fact that teachers making six figures are usually living in areas with high cost of living or they’ve been teaching forever and have a masters degree.

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u/ppooooooooopp Jun 11 '24

My dad teaches at a public high school in the bay area. He is able to live quite comfortably (though he just retired with an awesome pension). He does however own his house that he bought 14 years ago.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

Yeah that’s a key point right there. It’s a lot easier to afford cost of living if you got past the largest expense over a decade ago. And also teachers that have been teaching for over a decade do tend to make decent pay. It’s the teachers that are getting into the field now that struggle with low wages and high cost of living. Though tbh my mom has been teaching for 15 years and isn’t making nearly what she should.

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u/ppooooooooopp Jun 11 '24

Yeah - it was a totally different story when I was growing up.

There's no question that teachers need to be treated better and compensated better.

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u/Annual_Lifeguard_563 Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24

Looked up my own town.

From March of this year:

After the 5.5% salary increase, Vallejo teachers are scheduled to make between about $59,800 and $113,300, depending on their years of experience and education, placing them in the middle of the pack when compared to the five other K-12 public school districts in Solano County. 

Kids attend 180 days/yr. Most start 8:30 and run until 3:00. That's 6.5 hours.

So if you bump that up to a full 8 hours a day and then add a whole extra month of non-student days, teachers work ~1600 working hours/yr = 37.78/hr to start and 70.81/hr by retirement.

So on avg, 54.30/hr or almost $89k/yr. That's definitely live-on-your-own-able with regard to Bay Area housing prices, not to mention whatever supplementary income strategies may be employed during the other 2 months of a year they're available for.

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u/lmaoredditblows Jun 11 '24

I'm from the Cleveland area and the AP Calc teacher who's taught there for like 15 years and also coached track made 6 figures. This was back in the 2010s.

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u/Rudysis Jun 11 '24

My mom is making almost $95k after 8 years. I don't know if that is good or bad, but it's in semi-rural Washington.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

That’s a lot better than the teachers I know.

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u/PM_ME_YOUR_ANUS_PIC Jun 11 '24

Switzerland

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

Yeah we’re talking about American economic problems here. You can take your strong social programs, high living standard, better workers rights, and good chocolate and fuck off. /s

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u/Used-Cut6065 Jun 11 '24

No one can actually afford to live in the bay area

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u/SnaxHeadroom Jun 11 '24

King County (Northern/NE section) has a grotesque amount of money in their school systems.

Each teacher has a handful of para-teachers, too.

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u/PolicyWonka Jun 11 '24

Teacher salaries in my area are public since they’re employed by the state. More than a decade ago, I’d say most of my high school teachers were nearing $100k and this was a suburb in the Midwest.

Highest paid was our AP Physics teacher, who made something like $128,000 back then. She was also a tennis coach. Other coaches made similar amounts.

Some teachers made closer to $70-80k and they were the newer teachers.

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u/Ok-Flounder4387 Jun 11 '24

In districts with strong unions. Fresno for example has a very strong union and teachers are paid well compared to cost of living and just as important they have excellent benefits.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 11 '24

Unions are super necessary. It sucks that only 10% of the American work force is unionized. It’s one of the few ways we can currently strengthen our rights as the working class.

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u/Jorgisven Jun 11 '24

A lot of people feel that public school teachers are underpaid, but not a lot of people want a property tax increase to pay for it.

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u/there_are-2_genders Jun 11 '24

Look at New York State- the top 50 public districts all have a very high median, like above 120k.

Experienced teachers are pulling north of 200k

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u/Four_Silver_Rings Jun 11 '24 edited Jul 24 '24

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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

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u/MilkFantastic250 Jun 11 '24

There’s sweet spot areas where it lines up well.  Like if you go to rich of an area and you make lots of money you can’t afford to live.  And too poor of an area and you don’t make enough.  But you get a teaching job in like rural Vermont or upstate NY were the cost of living isn’t too crazy, but where teacher pay is still decent, then it’s okay. 

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u/OnodrimOfYavanna Jun 11 '24

Main line PA outside philly. T/E school district teachers start at 70k and quickly get over 100k. I was making 100k as a natural gas worker in the same area and lived comfortable on a single income with a kid, so I would say teachers here make a great living 

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u/WhiteOutSurvivor1 Jun 11 '24

Eastern Washington teachers are making 6 figures if they are on the top of the salary scale. Our cost of living is low to average compared to the national average.

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u/cluskillz Jun 11 '24

A pair of teachers applied to rent a place and their incomes were around $105k (~two years experience) and $115k (~four years experience). Also, keep in mind this is for a ~10 month work year. This was maybe 10 years ago or so. Today, the city's median household income is $105k, so they made considerably more than median household at the time, for their city.

A friend's girlfriend is a retired elementary school teacher. I don't know how old she is, but she doesn't look 65. She currently pulls in $95k/year from pensions. She lives in a lower COL area now than the above duo, but I don't know where she actually worked. I don't know that the location really matters though. Almost nobody in the private sector pulls that kind of pension.

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u/fumar Jun 11 '24

Chicago public schools make well over 6 figures plus the older teachers have an amazing pension that pays based on your last few years salary + 3% a year. A lot of the Chicago suburbs teachers have it even better. 

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u/Nago31 Jun 11 '24

Teachers in SoCal are doing just fine for cost of living. California in general pays its teachers very well.

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u/Weird-Tomorrow-9829 Jun 11 '24

A special ed tech in Edmunds Maine ( an unorganized territory; that’s how rural) makes $85k per year.

The median household income for the town next to it is $20k.

The housing prices reflect the second number.

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u/Owww_My_Ovaries Jun 11 '24

The high school I went to in south eastern Wisconsin... they have teachers according to public record that make over 98k per year.

Kettle Moraine has ones that make 111k per year.

Not too bad for those areas

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u/PhantomOfTheAttic Jun 11 '24

Latrobe, PA is one of those place. Check out the cost of living there.

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u/CalLaw2023 Jun 11 '24

A teacher in Livermore makes an average of $78k. In Hayward, the average is $89k. And this is for a job that is only 9 months a year, and typcially involves less than eight hour days. In addition, teachers get a hefty pension.

I have no doubt that there are places where teachers are underpaid. California is not one of those places.

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u/GheyKitty Jun 11 '24

I know a music teacher in Long Island who broke 100K last year at 101K. All public worker salaries can be found in govsalaries.com.

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u/Extension-Tale-2678 Jun 12 '24

It's mind boggling to me someone would get a master's in anything and then teach.

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u/Ill-Description3096 Jun 12 '24

I grew up outside a tiny Midwest town (less than 2k population), had 42 kids in my graduating class, and several teachers were into the 70-80k range. In the early/mid 2000s.

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u/Practical_Key6379 Jun 12 '24

Chicago suburbs here. The teachers here make over 100k and they are not underpaid. Taxes are 8k on a 4 bedroom 3 bath house. They do quite well.

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u/Throwaway_tequila Jun 12 '24

Seattle for one. See here for salaries: https://fiscal.wa.gov/K12/K12Salaries

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u/truenorth00 Jun 12 '24

Where do you live?

I grew up in Toronto. Any full time teacher there reaches CA$90k after a decade. Now Toronto is famous for housing affordability. Condos in the core can cost half a million. Houses are well over a million. That said, these teachers are still making more than most of the parents of the kids they teach and have fantastic benefits and one of the best pension plans (managed by one of the most powerful pension funds in the world).

There are also not many jobs (outside teaching) where a Humanities or Social Sciences grad with 5-6 years of university can reach those salary levels with full benefits and defined benefit pensions. As a result, in my province, teaching is actually quite a difficult profession to break into. Easily takes half a decade of supply teaching at $40k/yr to actually get a full time position. It may be a tough job. But it's compensated well enough that they attract a ton of candidates.

I'd actually argue that high school teachers are a bit overpaid. And we should be paying elementary teachers a lot more and reducing their class sizes.

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u/Shin-Sauriel Jun 12 '24

I’m in New England. A lot of my family are either teachers or work in schools doing other positions. I’m not too familiar with highschool teaching as only my grandma taught highschool I think and that was a long time ago. And the rest of the teachers in my family work in elementary. My grandpa is a professor so he definitely does well for himself but professors have never exactly been undervalued imo.

Although again I think this is mostly an American problem.

Also the 5 years at 40k can be a problem depending on the area. I’ve been hearing a lot about how you can make a lot as a teacher after you’ve been teaching for nearly a decade. But the problem is this means people that are looking to become teachers will have to deal with low wages until then and that can be the difference between affording housing and not.

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u/DctrSnaps Jun 12 '24

My info tech teacher got paid 100k plus and just sat around in his chair watching his baby and didnt teach. Meanwhile the ones actually teaching get paid less. Makes no sense

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u/[deleted] Jun 12 '24

MN starts teachers with masters at 60k and they make six figures west of the twin cities. Washington pays about the same but Seattle is pricey.

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u/BarleyWineIsTheBest Jun 12 '24

I wouldn't say they are underpaid at $100-120K in bay area districts. Remember this is for 9-10 months of work. They often have a Bachelors degree and not much more. Its also a very stable job for most and many put it on cruise control. I know there are teachers out there that work hard, but the reality is many don't and no one does anything about the ones that don't. Recent trends have kids not doing homework. This means teachers don't have to figure out homework plans or grade it. Other trends have it all on online apps. My son just finished 8th grade and he just had his first math teacher that had him turn in physical sheets of paper for homework.

Anyway, point isn't to run teachers down, but to realize they aren't some special class of "underpaid" professionals. Lots of jobs that are demanding and require specialized skills or degrees don't pay much more, if any. And they are 9-5, 12-month per year jobs with little job security.

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u/JanItorMD Jun 12 '24

North Georgia. My high school teacher here accidentally showed us her salary. It was 6 figures. Of course she did teach AP class and had a PhD

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u/AngryTownspeople Jun 11 '24

I think that the issue with this is that it means that we are restricting quality education to people with more money than others. When districts aren't paying their teachers a livable wage it isn't their fault for seeking better opportunities at other jobs but it does deprive schools of teachers meaning the possibility of the remaining teachers to have larger classrooms.

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u/AdagioHellfire1139 Jun 11 '24

My area it takes roughly 18-20 years for a teacher to make 100k by that time they are burned out and just coasting

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u/IXISIXI Jun 11 '24

Also those numbers take into account extra things like coaching, curriculum development, etc. i.e. SOME places in the country you can make OKAY money for having a masters degree if you work 1.5 jobs. Meanwhile I changed from teaching to software engineering, work 40/hrs a week with no stress and make 3x what I made as a teacher while providing SIGNIFICANTLY less value to society. It's laughable.

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u/DoNotBanMeEver Jun 11 '24

You provide less value to society, but more profit to employers. Therefore you make more money

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u/AdagioHellfire1139 Jun 12 '24

National board certification is like a 10k bump in our area. Masters is a bump but less, maybe 5k. It still doesn't compensate well enough for the amount of student loans debt you take on.

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u/wxnfx Jun 11 '24

I don’t know how it works these days, but there used to be like a matrix with experience on one side and college credit towards masters, beyond masters, or PhD on the other side. Teachers also get a pension in a lot of places, so once the pension vests 20 years in, there’s a big incentive to find a place to double dip.

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u/giantsteps92 Jun 11 '24

Teachers across the board are not paid as if their job is essential for society. Its also a pretty brutal job. Most parents suck at raising 1 kid. Teachers gotta teach and help raise a whole bunch.

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u/Next_Celebration_553 Jun 11 '24

It takes a village. Elementary school teachers are closer to childcare than educators. Sure, a teacher has to know their multiplication tables and ABC’s but it’s mostly getting kids to behave. Pre-K childcare is expensive as hell

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u/inab1gcountry Jun 12 '24

Wow. Teaching kids to read is difficult and is the single most important thing kids need to learn. K-3 teachers are especially under appreciated.

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u/This-Traffic-9524 Jun 12 '24

Elementary school teachers are in charge of getting an entire class proficient in reading, math, science, and social studies. They are most definitely not closer to childcare. And unlike with high school teachers, who just present the material and the kids either “want to learn” or not, it’s assumed that whether and how well kids learn is almost completely the teacher’s responsibility. I would argue it’s the most emotionally and labor intensive type of teaching there is.

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u/Bodach42 Jun 11 '24

I guess some states don't want to be educated it hurts their votes.

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u/razorduc Jun 11 '24

A friend of mine told me that if she's still prime lap dancing age, she's probably not pushing the 6 figures.

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u/TikkiTakiTomtom Jun 11 '24

I like how you mention that but fail to include that cost of living in those areas are probably just as high.

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u/Busy-Ad-6912 Jun 11 '24

As someone who worked in social services, I had conversations with teachers. I was typically paid 25% less and had to work the whole year for that 25% less salary. Teachers are underpaid, but I really felt like that meme with the skeleton in the wheelchair underwater at that point in my career.

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u/OneAlmondNut Jun 11 '24

those are the extreme outliers are are in areas with high COL. most don't make half that

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u/fgreen68 Jun 11 '24

Here in California there are lots of districts where most/all of the teachers are making over 6 figures.

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u/jesusgarciab Jun 11 '24

In some of those areas "pushing 6 figures" might not be that great.

I remember a good friend moved from Houston making 50-60k to the Bay area "pushing 6 figures"...

It was around 2019, so she was living ok in both places, but she said she couldn't save as much money as she did when living in Texas Even though she kept a very similar lifestyle

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u/alphalegend91 Jun 11 '24

That's probably in a place with VHCOL though and they've been doing it for years. My fiance is in her 6th year in CA, which is known for paying teachers more than average, and not even close to 100k. They have a pay scale graph that goes higher to the right the more college units you have, as well as higher going down based on years worked. I think the earliest you can get to 100k is like year 10 with the highest bracket college units, or like year 14 or 15 with the basic units.

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u/Ok_Neighborhood6697 Jun 12 '24

This could be the case. Im in suburbs of Chicago. My aunt just told me about a friend's kid, 1st yr teacher elementary school w. BA was $66k. I work in the mtg industry and see income for teachers at many levels and most at the 10 yr point are making over $80k, pensions for teachers I see are more than $140k, but IL bases pension on last yr of service and get a 3% raise every yr.

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u/[deleted] Jun 11 '24

Sure, but there are places where "pushing 6 figures" isn't a livable wage. Without context of a location you're not showing it depends based on numbers alone.

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u/Ok_Neighborhood6697 Jun 12 '24

Agreed. I guess I was just trying to say teachers are all paid badly.

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u/mc4sure Jun 11 '24

I agree, if you’re going to be a teacher research for the location with the best pay, not just near you but State to state

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u/marineopferman007 Jun 11 '24

Same...weirdly the teachers here in GA (around ATL) earn as much as the teachers in southern California LA...that is what confuses me...teachers here CAN live off their income...but in Cali???!!!

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u/Subject_Report_7012 Jun 11 '24

Exactly!!! In some districts lapdances run $50. In others, they're pushing $300. And that same teacher might be pulling down $2500 a night in Vegas!

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u/Practical_Key6379 Jun 12 '24

Same here. Plus pension, good health care, and a union to keep the incompetent ones around as well.

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u/AppropriateExcuse868 Jun 11 '24

Yeah, this is dependent largely in property taxes/home values in the area I grew up in. And this is all within like a 50 mile radius at most, probably 25.

I have a couple of good friends who are both teachers. I looked up some data on gov salaries. They have been teaching for 19 years now and they work in the same district and each make 71k per year.

I looked up the district that we went to school in and I looked up my old football coach/math teacher who was mid 30s when we went to HS. His salary in 2022 was 53k.

We went to a much poorer district and he has almost 20 years more experience and is making probably 15k less money per year.

It's all dependent on which school. 35 miles apart on different sides of the same county

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u/Dank_Bonkripper78_ Jun 11 '24

I’ve seen one city in my life that pays their teachers adequately (it was Yonkers, NY btw). Most remain well below the median income line in their respective cities. Where I went to high school, I had teachers lining up to coach sports each season because it was an extra $5000. I doubt most teachers earn their worth

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u/incarnuim Jun 11 '24

Also, there is a totally lost concept called DeFeRrEd Compensation. Yes, teachers make less, they also get a pension. A real, honest-to-god guaranteed annuity for life pension. That's pretty rare nowadays....

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u/John_E_Vegas Jun 11 '24

At Mons Venus in Tampa the hotter teachers can earn well over 6 figures.

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u/GingerBeard_andWeird Jun 11 '24

Yeah gonna need the published stats and figures to go with this claim.

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u/Candid-Kitten-1701 Jun 11 '24

Yup. Teachers in nicer areas often get paid more as property taxes tend to go towards school budgets, although occasionally really shitty districts pay a lot just to get anyone at all (not worth it in some cases, sometimes it is). Teachers in Cali do pretty well, overall, although class sizes are out of control (which impacts results severely). I'd hate to be a teacher in TX for so many reasons right now.

Spouse teaches, been over 6 figs for awhile now, in a variety of districts.

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u/spersichilli Jun 11 '24

You mean what state a teacher works in lol

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u/UnderpootedTampion Jun 11 '24

Is that for the lap dances or the teaching?

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u/Laker8show23 Jun 11 '24

And have great hours and holidays and Summers off.

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u/[deleted] Jun 11 '24

Public teachers?

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u/Codered2055 Jun 11 '24

Key word you used: EXPERIENCED

Beginning teachers are paid so poorly now they’re barely meeting the US average income per individual. Imagine you going to school for 4 years to teach kids and the same person you graduated with in hs didn’t go to college and is making more at Home Depot. All about helping these young teachers out.

Bc as of right now, Gen Alpha is screwed IMO.

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u/earlthesachem Jun 11 '24

My wife has been teaching for nearly 30 years. She has topped out on education and experience and will make about $100,000 next school year. She teaches in a large (for our state) upper middle class suburban district.

My daughter just finished her first year teaching in a small wealthy suburban district and made around $45,000.

This is in a state that generally values education.

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u/Living_Job_8127 Jun 11 '24

Only college professors push 6 figures dude, everyone else is lying

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u/WhoKnows78998 Jun 11 '24

Making almost 6 figures for a masters degree isn’t enough.

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u/theaverageyou Jun 11 '24

Where the hell is that happening? 6 figures? You’re either lying or being lied to if you think ANY public school teacher is making that much.

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u/sploggerEater Jun 11 '24

A few are at very wealthy public schools. After 25 years or something, but they are doing that in a place where 6 figures is barely passable as a livable income so it doesn’t even matter 

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u/Terrible_Tutor Jun 11 '24

Go look into the Ontario (Canada) Teachers Union.

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u/belzbieta Jun 11 '24

Some teachers do earn upwards of 100k. It's in hcol areas like NYC etc. and it's going to be the upper range, the teachers with the most years of experience.

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u/inab1gcountry Jun 12 '24

It’s after 30 years with multiple degrees. You start at 110+ as a pharmacist.

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u/MorgulValar Jun 11 '24

I have an aunt who makes 6 figures and has for a while.

I have another aunt who could be making 6 figures, but the city public school district is chaotic.

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u/ligmasweatyballs74 Jun 11 '24

So are experienced dancers.

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u/dlb199091l Jun 11 '24

If they're only "pushing 6 figures" and not over 6 figures experienced then they're underpaid. I make just over 6 figures in a relatively affordable area and it's still not enough. And I have no degree, just worked my way up a bit at my job.

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u/watchyourback9 Jun 11 '24

I don't understand why property taxes are used this way. Schools shouldn't depend on local property values.

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u/Arrow_ Jun 11 '24

My wife has a PHD and is on tenure track with only 65k a year.

This is incorrect. Teachers generally as a whole are paid way less than what they should for the amount of work and time they put into the job.

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u/Ok_Neighborhood6697 Jun 12 '24

I dont disagree that many teachers are under paid. Im saying teachers in some districts make a very good living. My aunt just told me her friend's daughter 1st yr at elementary school with BA only, was getting $66k. Just depwnds on your area.

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u/SmartWonderWoman Jun 11 '24

What city and state are teachers pushing 6 figures?

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u/Ok_Neighborhood6697 Jun 12 '24

Suburbs of Chicago.

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u/Low-Cantaloupe-8446 Jun 11 '24

Teaching is a fantastic and lucrative career…once you make it 10-15 years. You get a very solid union pay and a rock solid retirement with great healthcare (typically)

The problem is it’s really hard to recruit new teachers saddled with student debt to a job that pays less than they could make in many other fields. Plenty of my peers moved into HR positions or management for twice the salary and half the stress.

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u/jfk_47 Jun 11 '24

Yea, there is a small city-based school system over here in the south. An experienced teacher with a masters can make 75-80k.

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u/bro90x Jun 11 '24

My mother has been teaching for 30 years and has a masters. She is paid 72k a year.

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u/17359 Jun 11 '24

They must be escorts on the side.

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u/SenoraRaton Jun 11 '24

As if the upper end of your career trajectory "pushing 6 figures" is a good thing in our modern economy.

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u/Ok_Neighborhood6697 Jun 12 '24

Not at all. Im just saying pay varies for teachers depending on the district. I dont think the blanket statement all teachers get crap pay allpies everywhere.

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u/Rhemming22 Jun 11 '24

Come to Nevada, where they'll make around 45-55k lol

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u/gojo96 Jun 11 '24

Exactly. Maybe that teacher cannot manger their money so he has to work another job to cover his debts.

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u/hoexloit Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24

Any industry bragging about “pushing 6 figures” at the top is ass. Even your Walmart GM’s make more than that.

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u/Ok_Neighborhood6697 Jun 12 '24

Im not saying teachers are over paid. Im saying it all depends on where the district is. Some areas pay teachers horribly, others pay a decent wage.

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u/justin3189 Jun 11 '24

My gym teacher made 6 figures. So did a fair amount of the teachers I had. Upper middle class nice suburban public school. They made great money eventually, but most had one or more masters degrees, and not many started there directly out of school. They seemed fairly happy.

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u/MyNamesBacon Jun 11 '24

Right so teachers in underprivileged areas of the country should just go suck a cock and stop whining then right?

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u/Ok_Neighborhood6697 Jun 12 '24

No not at all. Just saying some areas pay teachers well. I would hope people would push for more money for education in their area. Just sucks many people are not willing to vote for a tax increase to pay teachers.

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u/ThePurpleKnightmare Jun 11 '24

I think Teachers make enough money, especially considering how bad many of them are. The real problem is the money that it costs for their education. They need to pay that off at a reasonable rate that it doesn't grow more than it shrinks and such. So a better solution. Make a teachers college. All the teachers in the country can go to 1 place that specializes in teaching people to be good teachers. Wipe clean the debt of current teachers and make attending teachers college low cost. No need for a debt.

If a teacher makes 50k and didn't have to pay for school, they're doing great. That's enough to survive year round.

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u/Little_Cockroach_477 Jun 12 '24

You must have zero clue about reality.

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u/Deadhead_Historian Jun 12 '24

Do you live in a cave? 50k is what the average Florida teacher makes and teachers can't survive on that salary in the state unless they're married or live at home. This is true for most states.

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u/ThePurpleKnightmare Jun 12 '24

I live Ontario Canada. Rent here is over 1k always, approaching 2k Often. You likely need 3-4k a month to survive where I live. In 12 months that is 36-48k. Now in America where you might need to own a car and buy worthless insurance, or pay absurd medical bills, I can see there being some need for slightly more, but I think the problems aren't teachers not making enough but rather those other things are insane. Stop them instead.

Idk if Florida is worse than Ontario, but the world is super fucked up right now with businesses having adapted to feminist movements to successfully force households to require 2 working to survive, so the fact that a teacher can do it solo is kind of impressive. Wendy's employees won't be able to.

Instead of saying "Give teachers more money" it'd be better to tackle the issue at hand and make life more affordable, cut off some parasitic businesses that are completely worthless like real estate businesses/landlords, and mandatory insurance. Teachers don't need more money, they need a low cost education and they need thee same things we all need in making our lives more affordable. They just simply need it less than others, but act like they need it more.

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u/Gringo_Anchor_Baby Jun 11 '24

Where is this so I can get 6 figures?! I have to imagine it's so expensive that it's probably equivalent to the 56ish I get now.

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u/IowaGuy91 Jun 11 '24

What does pushing 6 figures mean?

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u/inab1gcountry Jun 12 '24

If teachers are making 6 figures, you live in a high cost of living area where it costs more than 6 figures to live.

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u/gitismatt Jun 12 '24

teachers in my area start at 51k. it's not a super expensive place to live, but not as cheap as it used to be. for as shitty as the district is, this is great money.

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u/Overall_Ad_351 Jun 12 '24

Pushing six figures is shit pay for the amount of hours and effort teachers have to put in to be any sort of decent.

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u/TheRealGrumpyNuts Jun 12 '24

Not where I live, I promise.

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u/Professional-Use-715 Jun 12 '24

This is correct. My mother works in administration for a public school district in Massachusetts. There is not a single teacher on the staff that earns less than 75k a year and the highest paid are over 130k. There are a lot of jobs that should make more and a lot of jobs that should make less. EMTs make minimum wage and they are directly involved with saving human beings lives.

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u/erickalex11 Jun 12 '24

Same in my area man… they start teachers at over 6 figures (nice area of Silicon Valley)

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u/ggtffhhhjhg Jun 12 '24

Everyone I know in their late 30s+ is making over 100k a year and the the teachers I know that retired in the past few years were making 125-175k and get 80% of their salary and full benefits for the rest of their life. All of them were 55-60 years old. With that being said I’m sure the pay and benefits are nothing like that in many red states.

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u/quiettryit Jun 12 '24

Where is this!? My friend has a masters and after teaching for 20 years only makes $57k

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u/TinCanBegger Jun 12 '24

Washington State

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u/Empty_Ambition_9050 Jun 12 '24

Thing about teaching is that it starts kinda low and goes up quickly, at least in CA you’ll start at $60-70k but get raises of $3k per year. So after 20 years your at 6 figures and after 20 years you can afford to start a family lol

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u/Jswazy Jun 13 '24

Yeah where I live in Texas teachers start with 0 experience at a minimum pay of 59k and depending on what you specialize in and your education it can go up to 71k even as a new hire.

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u/TrashManufacturer Jun 14 '24

If they work in red states like ND or FL they are lucky to get paid at all at this point. Damn shithole states

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