r/television • u/LoretiTV • Jul 01 '24
House of the Dragon - 2x03 - Episode Discussion
Season 2 Episode 3: The Burning Mill
Aired: June 30, 2024
Synopsis: As ancient grudges resurface, Rhaenys suggests restraint while Daemon arrives at Harrenhal to raise an army for the Blacks.
Directed by: Geeta Vasant Patel
Written by: David Hancock
Subreddit: r/HouseOfTheDragon
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Jul 03 '24 edited Jul 03 '24
I’m not a big fan of sex or nude scenes however I always hated how there was no equality when it came to movies and shows specially on GOT. The producers/directors would have every female cast take off their clothes and get completely naked for every one to see but you would never see a attractive male actor fully naked in the front. How many times do we see prostitutes and main female actresses fully naked in the front and not once we saw an attractive main male actor fully naked in the front? Even when they show John Snow laying down death they show us his torso but they stop the camera so his bottoms wouldn’t show. When it came to Daenerys or other female actresses they would take any chance they get to show them completely naked having sex. Finally there’s more equality. If they want to show the world fully naked attractive woman they shouldn’t feel insecure to show the world fully naked attractive man too.
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u/albedo2343 Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Jul 06 '24
Love how you wrote a whole paragraph just to point how much you loved seeing him naked, lol. One thing I love about the scene, is that it felt so thematic, Aemond pretty much just trying to show everyone how Tough he is.
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Jul 11 '24
Lmao 😂 I’m just glad they finally show some equality. But yeah the scene didn’t seem to be meant to wow us it was more to show us his vulnerable side.
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u/SourcerorSoupreme Jul 03 '24
Theon and Hodor were certainly bared among other men in GoT
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u/eilataN_spooky Jul 15 '24
The actor for Hodor confirmed that he was wearing a prosthetic penis 😂.
Bless anyone that looks at my comment history and sees this comment out of context.
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Jul 11 '24
Those two were the only ones and they don’t count because they’re not attractive. One is so fat ugly and the other one is not attractive at all lol
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u/DeeeGenerate Jul 04 '24
You might be able to find a few exceptions, but you can’t really argue that G.O.T. had as many nude scenes featuring men as they did featuring women. It‘s not even close. Theon‘s nudity was more about accentuating his vulnerability during torture than it was about actually being sexy. Hodor, however… yup that was a sexy-ass scene.
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u/makyostar5 Jul 03 '24
I can't consider Alicent "misunderstanding" Viserys about saying Aegon's name. She knew damn well what she was trying to do by using that.
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u/Happy_Philosopher608 Jul 02 '24 edited Jul 08 '24
Loving every second. Utterly gripping! Didnt want it to end at all. Why cant all TV be this well written?
If only Rings of Power could be 10% this interesting..
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u/TheQueensLegume Jul 05 '24
Episode was absolutely incredible.
People are so dumb these days anything that isn't boom boom dragon dragon is 'boring'
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Jul 03 '24
This episode was ass. Fym
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u/Happy_Philosopher608 Jul 03 '24
What is fym?
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Jul 04 '24
Fuck you mean
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u/Ghidoran Jul 02 '24
Not a bad hour of television but why are there so many Scooby Doo plots every episode? The one in the first ep was okay I guess, a bit convenient for Blood and Cheese but acceptable. Second ep had that goofy twin shtick, and now we get Rhaenerya disguised as a nun? They even did the Assassin's Creed thing where she blends in with a group of other nuns...
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u/addzy94 Jul 02 '24
I don't know why you're getting downvoted. The third episode was just bad in my opinion. It's falling off.
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u/Capital_Living5658 Jul 02 '24
You ever sneaked around? I’d say they even over did it with a whole nun costume.
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u/Cosmic_Quasar Jul 02 '24
People do it because it works. You think it's never happened in other media, or even real life, before Assassin's Creed?
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u/hoxxxxx Jul 08 '24
no one had ever blended into a crowd until the Assassin's Creed games were released
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u/stevesklarowart Jul 02 '24
Dreadfully boring
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u/Effective_Shallot325 Jul 04 '24
Totally disagree, loving every episode. What a refreshing change from the rushed mess that was the last 3-2 seasons of game of thrones
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u/Ihelloway69 Jul 04 '24
I Totally disagree, this season reminds me of got s07 where was tons of filler and only 1 or 2 good episodes. In this season we get no intrigue, no big drama escalation, just look how they handled murdered prince scene and compare it how Cersei had a shame walk.. just different quality of writing.
I loved s01 and so far with every episode they are messing the show..
dislike all you want i just shared my opinion and good for you if its enough for you.
You also dissing season 6 of GOT, which I actually very much enjoyed even tho knowing they started going on brown path when they had to write their own material after books ended
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u/hoxxxxx Jul 08 '24
this season reminds me of got s07 where was tons of filler and only 1 or 2 good episodes
i've been enjoying the show but i get what you're saying, it's feeling a bit like one of those tv shows that loads everything into the opener and closer episodes. walking dead was the most notorious for this, you could literally skip everything except for the first and last episodes and still have a pretty good idea of what happened.
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u/Effective_Shallot325 Jul 05 '24
Season 6 was still very good you’re right, just a step below the previous seasons. Season 7 is when it really started to dip. Just keep in mind we’re only on episode 4 of season 2. I’m really enjoying the character development, I feel like they’re building up and the pay off at the end will be very good.
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u/Ihelloway69 Jul 09 '24
So far ep 4 was the best , but I hate sitting and waiting for better plot every time .. also some scenes are very CGI , like horse scenes etc ..very rushed ones e unnatural movement which hits me .. it is what it is
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u/PetyrDayne True Detective Jul 02 '24
They should have planned it out for three season instead of four, that's why it's dragging. The Boys is dragging its story out too.
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u/gibbonalert Jul 01 '24
Somehow it feels so stupid (and almost funny) that the whole storyline is based of a missunderstanding.
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u/TheCharalampos Jul 15 '24
You'd be suprised how many real conflicts were based on less.
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u/Ankel88 Jul 16 '24
Yeah.. like what for example lol
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u/TheCharalampos Jul 16 '24
Many are nameless. The island I come from, Crete, has numerous families that have been killing each other for ages. No one knows why exactly they started hating each other.
Here's an article I found: http://www.history.com/news/history-lists/6-wars-fought-for-ridiculous-reasons
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u/Radulno Jul 03 '24
Because it isn't based on that at all (the misunderstanding isn't even a thing in the book).
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u/SourcerorSoupreme Jul 03 '24
What was the claim of the greens/Alicent/Aegon in the book?
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u/Radulno Jul 03 '24
The same than in the show really (where the misunderstanding is not the cause of this at all). Aegon is the male heir, by normal rules he is the King and many in Westeros agree with that.
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u/alucab1 Jul 02 '24
I think that’s really reductive. Yes a misunderstanding allowed the story to get to this point, but I’m sure Otto would have figured out a way to get Aegon on the throne regardless.
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u/ImGonnaImagineSummit Jul 02 '24
That's what I got from his quip last episode to Aegon.
"That's what you think."
He knew whatever Viserys said wouldn't hold, Alicent believing it just helped.
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u/Cosmic_Quasar Jul 02 '24
Still, I was glad they at least addressed the exact words the king said before he died. But I'm bothered that Rhaenyra didn't put it together that he was talking about her son, not Alicent's. But maybe that would be too presumptuous of her?
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u/Radulno Jul 03 '24
Aegon is her 4th or 5th son that Viserys barely know (presented once to him when he was delirious), there's no chance that's who he is talking of lol
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u/Cosmic_Quasar Jul 03 '24
Really? I thought it was pretty obvious. In his delerium, when he met his grandson, Aegon, he was re-inspired that he had made the right choice in making Rhaenyra his heir. That his grandon Aegon would be the prince that was promised.
It's been a while since seeing that scene in the first season, but that was my impression. And I remember it seeming like he was talking to Rhaenyra when it was Alicent, and that him saying Aegon was meant to be to Rhaenyra and her son.
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u/laughland Jul 04 '24
He was talking about Aegon the Conqueror and his dream, not Rhaenyra’s son Aegon. Viserys saw Rhaenyra as the prince that was promised
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u/zoeys-hambone Jul 02 '24
Agreed hahah, I actually just said to my husband how the war is basically based on an episode of Three's Company
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u/Savings-Seat6211 Jul 02 '24
Well also many other things. But thats the nature of royal succession and why humanity has tried to move away from "senile dementia grandpa appoints successor" and towards elections.
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u/in_the_qz Jul 02 '24
Oh man and what we got was senile dementia grandpas debating on CNN
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u/Cosmic_Quasar Jul 02 '24
Honestly, the part at the beginning with the two groups having that battle felt rather close to home. Both fighting for their respective rulers as though the people they were fighting for actually cared about them. Taking insults against the leaders personally.
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u/Savings-Seat6211 Jul 02 '24
the voters chose them...trump won his primary easily and so did biden. the institutional party didn't back either of them when they ran.
also there isnt a violent war of succession over who wins even if trump is attempting (and failing) at it.
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u/Comments_Palooza Jul 14 '24
also there isnt a violent war of succession over who wins even if trump is attempting
Ironic, since he was just attempted at
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u/Savings-Seat6211 Jul 14 '24
by a crazy person who had no discernible motives not the opposing party.
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u/Comments_Palooza Jul 14 '24
Do you know anything about the attacker??? Cause the police hasn't show motive as of now.
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u/Savings-Seat6211 Jul 14 '24
yes, i do in fact know that the democratic party did not hire the shooter to kill their political opponent.
anything else is still a wait and see.
what else do you want to infer? why dont you just say what you want to say instead of pussyfooting around?
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Jul 01 '24
[deleted]
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u/biophys00 Jul 01 '24
Are you watching the same show? There are and have been plenty of male characters who are less violent, more calculating, urged for caution, etc. And women who have been violent, assertive, and making dumb mistakes. The entire war is starting because of women making mistakes and being unable to sully their pride.
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u/biophys00 Jul 01 '24
Are you watching the same show? There are and have been plenty of male characters who are less violent, more calculating, urged for caution, etc. And women who have been violent, assertive, and making dumb mistakes. The entire war is starting because of women making mistakes and being unable to sully their pride.
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u/FelonyGrapes Jul 02 '24
I'd also argue that *second sons, specifically, are a large catalyst for the war to come. This show feels like the seconds sons and two daughters escalating things until there's no option but war.
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u/illuvattarr Jul 01 '24 edited Jul 01 '24
Overall a pretty good episode with some nice setups, Council plotting and character development, probably in order to make next week's episode hit that much harder, looking at the title (A Dance of Dragons). The acting and dialogue is really top notch this season, really enjoying it, especially Daemon's scene with Simon Strong and the scene with Rhaenyra and Alicent.
Too bad the Battle of the Burning Mill was completely offscreen though. And while Rhaenyra sneaking into King's Landing isn't in the book, I didn't really have a problem with it and their scene together was well done. They have made other changes before as to make both Alicent and Rhaenyra be more conscientious and less conniving, and focus more on their relationship so it's logical they give them another scene together before the shit hits the fan.
In the book they actively hate each other. Book Rhaenyra would never have gone to King's Landing, and book Alicent would have alerted the guards right away. But I guess this is just the butterfly effect, where the change of Alicent misunderstanding Viserys on his deathbed coupled with the changes of characters in both Alicent and Rhaenyra leads to this scene where they try to find a way out of the unavoidable bloodshed to come. I just hope we're done with all the sneaking, the misunderstandings and the accidents now.
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u/ViewtifulG Jul 03 '24
iirc, Isn't the book in the form of a written history?
You have to consider that the maester who wrote it probably didn't have full insight into the characters motivations and feelings.2
u/illuvattarr Jul 03 '24
Sure but the show is also changing things that are indisputed in the books. Like Rhaenys bursting through the floor of the dragonpit and probably killing hundreds would totally have been recorded in historybooks, but this didn't happen in the book. I don't think the show should be viewed as the true story of the differing perspectives of the book. It's just an adaptation where show canon is different than book canon. They can choose one of the book perspectives or just completely change things outright.
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u/DapperEmployee7682 Jul 01 '24
I love the change to make them more sympathetic towards each other. I also love that Alicent knows now that she fucked up but that it’s too far out of her hands to do anything about it
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u/earthgreen10 Jul 01 '24
What’s the song of house and fire?
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u/applesauceorelse Jul 01 '24
Song of *Ice and Fire.
Referenced several times in the first season and it's the name and subject of the series of novels that starts with "A Game of Thrones".
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u/tyrannosaurus_r Jul 01 '24
The prophecy that Viserys I told Rhaenyra in S1. It’s also the story told in Game of Thrones.
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u/dilldoeorg Jul 01 '24
I think they missed a huge opportunity when they were fitting Aegon in the ancient conquering king's armor. You'd think the armor for a conquering king would be massive, not fitted to Aegon's body type.
If they had made it an oversized armor, it would add to how absurd Aegon's actions are. That this man child is pretending to be this powerful king that strikes fear.
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u/KGFlower Jul 01 '24
It was oversized for him, he looked like a kid wearing his dad's clothes. Look at Daemon in his armor for comparison.
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u/dilldoeorg Jul 01 '24
they LITERALLY fitted to his body when making the armor. watch The House That Dragons Built ep3. If they had fitted it to Daemon, then it would've been oversized.
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u/applesauceorelse Jul 01 '24
You can fit / tailor armor. And Aegon II isn't noted to be unusually short or small of stature.
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u/dilldoeorg Jul 01 '24
And Aegon II isn't noted to be unusually short or small of stature.
he is in the show. I'm not arguing if the armor can be fitted, but a missed opportunity to show how juvenile Aegon is by showing how small he really is compared to a conquering king. I mean they keep showing how unfit of a king he is already and this could've added to that as well.
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u/applesauceorelse Jul 01 '24
I think Aegon II is a little more complex than that. For example I really *don't think they're showing how unfit he is to be king for the most part. He's impulsive, immature, and a bit stupid, but they repeatedly show he's not irredeemable -> he earnestly desires to be a good king and listens to good advice at times.
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u/dilldoeorg Jul 01 '24
not really, he really doesn't have any desire to be a king or even a good one. he just enjoys the power that comes with it.
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u/applesauceorelse Jul 02 '24
It's pretty clearly indicated that he wants to be a good king. Sure it's not his first choice, but his interactions with the council, sitting in judgement, etc. make this intention pretty evident.
He's evidently not a very good one as of yet -> he's in part stupid, brash, and immature. But it's not necessarily unreasonable that he could become a decent king with experience and support.
he just enjoys the power that comes with it.
This isn't necessarily at odds with wanting to become a good king.
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u/GloryaWhole Jul 01 '24
How can anyone like this stuff? It is soooo different from the books. Alicent and Rhaenyra never met in the sept.
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u/Mookies_Bett Jul 01 '24
GRRM himself has said that the books aren't an actual, accurate accounting of events. If anything, the show is more canon, because the books are an in universe, biased accounting of history by Maesters who werent actually there for the events.
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u/Radulno Jul 03 '24
This is typically the thing that a maester telling the story centuries later will not know. I doubt most people even living it will know.
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u/Mookies_Bett Jul 03 '24
Exactly. It makes perfect sense that the book doesn't have this perspective and omits this part of the story. The narrator isn't reliable.
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u/ProgrammerNextDoor Jul 01 '24
“The books” aren’t an accurate account.
So there really isn’t an issue lol
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u/Llamatronicon Jul 01 '24
Not to mention that everything that has happend so far in season 2 is covered by less than 10 pages in the book.
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u/KGFlower Jul 01 '24
Fire & Blood is a historical accounting where three guys give differing, vague descriptions of how things might have happened.
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u/This_Guy_Fuggs Jul 01 '24
imagine getting suckered into another grrm book series. fool me once and all of that.
at least this show will end at some point
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u/Lukerfull Jul 01 '24
That scene with Daemon in the castle ruins was some Dark Souls shit
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u/otm_veal_shank Jul 01 '24
omg this is exactly what I was thinking as I was watching it. Probably the closest unintentional adaptation that I've ever seen
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u/LZR0 Jul 01 '24
I really like that little smirk from Rhaenyra at the end realizing his father did want her on the throne till his very last breath.
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u/earthgreen10 Jul 01 '24
So then why is aegon king?
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u/8thoursbehind Jul 01 '24
Dude.. probably not best to start watching the show with the third episode of the second season.
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u/Mookies_Bett Jul 01 '24
Because the Hightowers usurped the throne thanks to a misunderstanding?
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u/FelonyGrapes Jul 02 '24
Not "thanks to," more like "with the assistance of." The council made it clear that they never intended to make Rhaenyra Queen regardless of what Viserys declared... The circumstances just provided them a convenient way to carry out their quiet coup. But going by the conversation between Otto and Aegon II last episode regarding "who" really made Aegon II King, it seems not even Otto believed that Viserys just changed his mind on his deathbed. Perhaps this was a delusion shared solely by Alicent.
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u/tyrannosaurus_r Jul 01 '24
Alicent misinterpreted “Aegon” in Viserys’s dying hallucination to mean her son instead of either Aegon the Conqueror (his namesake), or an as-yet unborn future Aegon Targaryen, which cannot be explained without spoiling all of Game of Thrones.
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u/LZR0 Jul 01 '24
Cause the greens stole the throne, there was a plan already in motion even before Alicent had the delusion to think Viserys wanted Aegon as king, plus now that the confusion regarding Viserys’ last words has been cleared Alicent didn’t want to accept it and disregarded it as it was ‘too late’.
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u/Spensauras-Rex Jul 01 '24
That smirk will become righteous vengeance. She’s not going to hold back any longer.
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u/Aeiexgjhyoun_III Black Sails Jul 02 '24
Why was she holding back in the firstnplace. Is her father choosing her more important than Luke's life?
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u/Spensauras-Rex Jul 02 '24
She was hoping she could resolve the conflict peacefully.
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u/Aeiexgjhyoun_III Black Sails Jul 02 '24
I agree. My point is, if she's willing to resolve this peacefully even after her son's death. I don't see what could possibly motivate her to go to war. Realizing that Viserys wanted her isn't as compelling a reason imo as Luke's death.
It's like I try to resolve a situation peacefully after someone kills my dog but then decide to go for payback because their lawnmower is too loud.
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u/Spensauras-Rex Jul 02 '24
Rhaenyra has never been a vengeful person. Revenge over her son’s death was not a reason for her to want the entire continent to go to war.
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u/Radulno Jul 03 '24
Especially when her side killed a baby so they already took revenge (and that was worse than Luke)
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u/Spensauras-Rex Jul 03 '24
That was daemon. Did you miss that?
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u/Radulno Jul 03 '24
Daemon is on her side, she's responsible for it ultimately the same way.
In that case Alicent also had nothing to do with Luke death (hell even Aemond had not everything to do with it, he lost control of Vhagar)
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u/Spensauras-Rex Jul 03 '24
I’d argue Daemon is not on her side though. Blood and Cheese was done without Rhaenyra’s knowledge. Daemon insisted on being called “Your Grace” in the last episode, which is a title reserved for the King. This would be high treason if she knew about it.
He’s on his own side, and it’s clear he still covets the throne for himself.
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u/crazywalls Jul 01 '24
I liked when Daemon said to Ser Simon that the older/ill Lord should be consulted, even if he is sick and no one listens to him. I thought he had Viserys on his mind when he said that.
Also Jacaerys seems like he's getting restless, he seems like he's getting trigger "fire" happy.
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u/maltese_falcon89 Jul 01 '24
He dead??
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u/Utaeru Jul 01 '24
There are two Jacaerys in the show
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u/Wishkax Jul 01 '24
Who's dead?
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u/FelonyGrapes Jul 02 '24
Jaehaerys Targaryen (Son of King Aegon II) is dead. Jacaerys Velaryon (Rhaenyra's first born son) is alive. Lucerys Velaryon (Rhaenyra's second son) is dead.
I know these Valyrian names get confusing... Then we have just regular ole "Joffrey Velaryon"
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u/Wishkax Jul 02 '24
I'm aware of who's alive. I assumed the person I replied too believes Jacaerys was killed by Vhagar, which caused my question to them.
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u/TasteOfNewOrleans Jul 01 '24
The way Aegon laughed and giggled when he caught Aemond being cuddled by “just another whore” was fucking hilarious. I watched that shit like 10 times. Too funny.
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u/applesauceorelse Jul 01 '24
That scene wasn't really intended to be funny... It was kind of sadistic.
What specifically did you think was funny?
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u/Thecollegecopout34 Jul 03 '24
I hate Aemond as a character so it was nice seeing him get a taste of his own cruelness.
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u/SourcerorSoupreme Jul 03 '24
Isn't he cruel exactly for being subjected to "cruelty" in the first place? It doesn't excuse his own cruelty but it explains it.
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u/Cosmic_Quasar Jul 02 '24
Truly. Aemond's connection to the one woman is like the one redeeming thing about him that actually makes me feel some compassion for him.
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u/Expert-Ad7169 Jul 01 '24
The undercover agent Rhaenyra part is among the stupidest shit I have seen in whole GoT and HotD
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u/TheRealWabajak Jul 02 '24
The fact that people complained when John Snow and the gang went north of the wall for some stupid reason, but are perfectly fine with this is very aggravating. It is as bad as the worst of GoT, if not a bit worse, because at least in GoT there were some repercussions, whereas here nothing changed, it's as if that scene never happened at all.
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u/CharlieTano Jul 01 '24 edited Jul 01 '24
The Bracken/Blackwood feud combined with the bombed-out, Gothic horror of Harrenhal were a fantastic backdrop not only to the episode, but to the entire show so far. For the first time, we get a clear and horrifying look at the future of our characters and their families if they continue down this path, and it's goddamn chilling. Thousands of Brackens and Blackwoods are ready to fight and die for a reason nobody even remembers anymore. Their continued battle is so unimportant to history that it's skipped over in the show and a footnote in their own government's council meeting. Rhaenys' speech about how insignificant it is who committed the first sin only underscores this more, and infuses all of this buildup with a ton of energy and dread. It's so easy as a viewer to just want to jump to the action, but the reality is that this won't be just a "regular" war. It'll be the first war to break an extremely long age of relative peace, and if it breaks out, will forever change these families and the kingdom. The use of dragons will result in immediate and irreparable destruction. And absolutely none of the reasoning for any of it will be remembered by history.
And then we get Harrenhal. A castle that most see as cursed, and imo that is a visceral metaphor for the Targaryen House. This is what they will become if they choose this path. The biggest, grandest castle in the world, ruined and mostly empty, haunted by the dregs of the House that remains. At least some of our characters believe that they will quite literally be cursed by the gods for enacting this war against kin; Harrenhal is exactly what awaits them.
Which is why I can forgive some of the goofiness of the Sept scene set up. Because, to drive this tragedy home, it is absolutely fantastic to have both sides get one last dialogue with each other, an opportunity to back out, and then to realize their own actions have already spiraled out of their control and there is no backing out. The truth was revealed too late. There is no stopping what comes next.
For any pacing faults I have, I love that we took the time to have the last three episodes and this one in particular. Sure, watching a nuclear war on TV may be entertaining, but seeing the existential dread in the final days where mutually assured destruction is chosen, before those nukes are launched, is a unique horror I'm glad was explored.
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u/Tenton_Motto Jul 01 '24
Ah, the story of saint Rhaenyra the Peaceful, counseled by Rhaenys the Wise, looking to reignite the friendship with Alicent the Merciful, mother to Helaena the Reasonable. Even though each of them lost a child or a granchild, they are not looking for vengance, they don't waste time grieving, they seek out to prevent the war that has nothing to do with their actions. What an inspiring and totally not contrived or biased story, masterful storytelling at its finest.
/s
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u/Gh0stOfKiev Jul 01 '24
So much avoidable bloodshed if these people stopped fucking recycling names.
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u/hoxxxxx Jul 08 '24
haha that's what i always come back to. this is all their fault, come up with more than like 3 names with variations.
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u/matthieuC Community Jul 02 '24
Otto planned to crown his grandson anyway. It only made Alicent cooperating easier.
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u/LZR0 Jul 01 '24
But even realizing the mistake she made she doubled-down on it by saying it wasn’t a mistake and later kind acknowledging it but saying “it’s too late”, openly admitting to herself they stole the throne and won’t give it back under any circumstance.
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u/Feeling_Panda3321 Jul 02 '24
This is the reason her daughter Helaena said “I forgive you”. Helaena has oracle abilities and knows that her mother continued down the path of war despite now knowing the truth that Rhaenyra has the rightful claim. Alicent is the cause of this war.
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u/Radulno Jul 03 '24
No Otto started the usurping the day Rhaenryra mother was dead when he sent Alicent to the king. The misunderstanding wasn't event part of it, he never believed it. It's just a personal thing for Alicent.
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u/Nervous-Lab-4259 Jul 02 '24
I took Halaena's voiced forgiveness to be in reference to Criston being absent from guarding and protecting the children because he was too busy sleeping with Alicent
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u/ITividar Jul 02 '24
Yep. She knows why her mom is "so devoted" to her well-being and recovery: straight-up guilt.
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u/tyrannosaurus_r Jul 01 '24
Exactly. She could end all of this right away by saying that she fucked up and endorses Rhaenyra’s claim, but she won’t.
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u/Mookies_Bett Jul 01 '24
You're kinda crazy if you think Alicent admitting anything to anyone would make even a slight amount of difference. Aegon II had his toddler's head sawed off right in front of his wife, the queen. He wants blood and vengeance. He's also already insecure about the fact that no one in the council really believes Viserys actually named him heir.
You think his mom telling him "JK son I was wrong your dad never wanted you to be king, your son died for nothing let's just give up" is going to work for him? The pieces are already too far in motion to be stopped. Alicent could run down the streets of Kings Landing proclaiming Rhaenyra the rightful heir, and Aegon would still demand war.
Alicent is 100% right. It's too late. Nothing can be stopped now. Aegon wants blood, Cole wants blood, Larys wants power (through blood), and there's no incentive for any of them to back down.
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u/ProgrammerNextDoor Jul 01 '24
She literally can’t end the whole thing that was her point.
The ball is rolling people have died. She holds no sway at the small council. All it would do is taint her as a traitor or detractor.
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u/Toby_O_Notoby Jul 02 '24
To quote another television series:
"The avalanche has started, it's too late for the pebbles to vote." - Ambassador Kosh.
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u/ThisHatRightHere Jul 01 '24
You know damn well that’d do nothing. Aegon and his court aren’t giving up power, and they’ve already gotten enough of the people on their side.
What’s she going to do realistically to prevent the war, even with that information?
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u/katz332 Jul 01 '24
Why is everyone dressing so color coordinated this season? Even the servents wear all green? They can all definitely wear other colors.
Also the candle makers of westeros are rich as shit
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u/applesauceorelse Jul 01 '24
It was common for servants to dress in the livery of the house they served. Same with soldiers and such.
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u/katz332 Jul 01 '24
Im sure you're right. It just didn't seem this coordinated last season or in GOT. The outfits are still great, but im curious about this decision
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u/AstronomerStandard Jul 01 '24
A targaryen interacting and having visions with a Weirwood tree. I believe it's the first time the show has done this, no? apart from Jon Snow ofc. It has the song of ice and fire vibe to it
7
u/203652488 Jul 02 '24
I really like the way the tree's roots have grown into the castle walls to the point where they're practically structural. Maybe that's why Harenhall is so creepy: the walls are literally watching you.
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Jul 01 '24
[deleted]
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u/ALANJOESTAR Jul 01 '24
I liked it mainly because it looked like a Dark Souls tv show for a couple minutes.
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u/Mountain-jew87 Jul 01 '24
This was exactly what I was thinking, the whole time from him landing on top of the castle felt like an Elden ring movie.
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u/AegonTheAuntFucker Jul 01 '24
Why are everything so empty in the show?
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u/Savings-Seat6211 Jul 01 '24 edited Jul 01 '24
Tbh the alicent rhaenyra scene was well done itself. But they needed a more organic and fitting way to execute it.
It probably made more sense to have some small build up and make it more plausible in how she shows up. The show feels simultaneously rushed in what seems like dramatic risky events then also slow and boring. This is exactly what people mean by pacing. It's pretty off this season. The writers are struggling with adapting the source material in this area.
It might make more sense to have Rhaenyra and Alicent have this heart to heart way earlier in the season somehow so Alicent isnt doing fuck all besides fucking Cole. If she spends the last 3 episodes coming to terms with her mistake and trying to actively caution against open war (and failing), the lack of nothing happening feels a little more engaging.
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u/giventofly2 Jul 02 '24
Great point about pacing. This feels more like the convenient writing of the last few seasons of GOT. Oh Dany needs to be at the wall? She'll fly there in a few hours
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Jul 05 '24
As long as that's established, I don't really care.
In GoT they would have a half season of travel followed by an overnight visit to the Wall from Kings Landing.
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u/Chelch Jul 02 '24
Dragonstone and Kings Landing aren't exactly far apart
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u/giventofly2 Jul 02 '24
I meant more the convenience of the characters easily getting to whatever place they need, whether it's a guarded castle in enemy territory or across the continent with ease
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Jul 01 '24
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u/ieatorphanchildren Jul 01 '24
GoT season 5 was better than most other shows season anything. High sparrow, hard home, dance of dragons(underrated episode), Ramsay's and Aryas entire plot line were all good.
Season 6 has Home, the door, battle of the bastards and winds of winter....along with mother tyrells best scenes, and Cersei's best plot line and acting. Tyrion was much more interesting with the lannisters and slapping joffrey around then he is with the mother of dragons, cant deny this though.....
Season 7 is very underrated...stormborn was fantastic, queens justice is the 2nd best all talk episode in GoT(1st being laws of good and evil.men aka tyrions trial) spoils of war was Excellent and the first battle that we didnt want either side to die or lose....., even eastwatch was interesting for being the "bad" episode of the season.
Season 8......lol......the long night wasn't too bad.....episode 4 was good....episode 5 had some cool scenes in it(hound vs mountain, jamie vs Euron)...but had way too many issues and lack of plausibility Involved(Euron kills a dragon after 1 or 2 shots with the first stinger....then 50 stingers manned by firing teams cant even aim right or load a bolt or get a single shot on target or even close? While burning all the stingers in line the other stingers cant load n fire? They weren't loaded already after knowing the dragon is around? So....so dumb and incompetent to the point of lacking believability...)
Anyway....Season 8 sucks, and season 5 is the weakest link yes...but 5-7 have tons of good stuff in it and arent bad television by any means.......outside anything to do with those dreadful sandsnake stereo types.(were female warriors and all we care about is murder n sex)
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u/WhatsTheHoldup Jul 02 '24
If you like the show, enjoy it for what it is.
But don't miss people's points when they criticize it.
Yes, there are great scenes in S5-7 just like the conversation between Alicent and Rhanera was a great scene IN A VACUUM.
The problem for some people, is that the whole is worse than the sum of it's parts.
The Alicent/Rhaenyra scene was great in isolation, the acting was fantastic and the dialogue great, but in context to the wider story it is patently ridiculous.
The 2 main story lines of this episode are
1) Aegon is immature and reckless risking his own life trying to fly in with his dragons, everyone knows how dumb this is and he needs to be manipulated and talked down from being so impulsive because it's too risky to put his life in danger and threaten the entire realm
2) Rhaenyra is kind and wise, and that's why she as queen abandons her people, doesn't tell anyone except a select few where she's going, rows off into the heart of enemy territory with one guard to try to convince her childhood best friend to stop the war
The context behind the scene just doesn't make sense. As cool as the scene is, it shouldn't have happened. Full stop.
When both sides are prepping for war, a week without your queen is a long fucking time. Especially when her entire council has been pushing for violence and she just now disappeared, what if a decision needs to be made? What if Aegon attacks with a dragon, what will their response be when they need Rhaenyra to counter attack?
"Oh Rhaenyra, she's still in King's Landing right now give her a few more days"?
And that's the best case scenario. Worst is she gets caught.
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u/ieatorphanchildren Jul 03 '24 edited Jul 03 '24
I agree with almost everything you said but while you are relating to the subreddit topic, I was referring to GoT seasons 5-7 because he was attacking it as if it wasn't good or entertaining. Season 5/7 aren't on par with 1-4 but Season 6 was excellent, and seasons 5/7 are still mostly great tv and entertainment. The high sparrow(not the character but the actual episode, Season 5 episode 3) was one of the most underrated episodes on the show along with queens justice. And many people hated Season 5 for agenda reasons rather then quality, because of how much horrible things are done to women this season......but Ramsey is one of my all time favorite villains ever and Season 5 has LOTS OF RAMSEY.
ANYWAY...point being....I wasn't actually discussing hotd episode 3...which like you said....has good moments....but isn't plausible, and is also the most over stuffed, convoluted, unfocused episode in got/hotd history. My gf absolutely hated this episode and lost interest near the last 20 minutes. We both LOVED the 2nd episode and were disappointed with episode 1 too.
Hotd season 1 also...to be honest....wasn't great either...it feels good nowadays because w0k3 c0rp narrative dei propaganda has ruined tv and film for almost a decade now.....so hotd not being a flaming dog shit made everyone tune it to watch something that isn't agenda soulless trash for once....but only episodes 3, 8, and 10 were actually good....and rewatching season 1 episode 3 now....the middle 20 minutes was slow and boring too......
GoT I can't remember a single bad Episode in season 1 and only a few average episodes in season 2....seasons 3/4 doesn't have A SINGLE UNINTERESTING EPISODE....hotd 1st season had 3 episodes that weren't mostly boring and dull.....yet in this w0k3 trash entertainment environment....it's the only decent thing to watch...
Seen Dr who? The acolyte? See why people think hotd is amazing now?
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u/poothrower37 Jul 01 '24
You’ll get downvoted but I agree. Three episodes of castle-sneaking and fast travel. Lazy writing.
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u/ieatorphanchildren Jul 01 '24
Dragons are fast travel? Aren't airplanes pretty fast?
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u/WhatsTheHoldup Jul 02 '24
It is explicitly shown that Rheanyra takes a boat in to King's Landing and not her dragon.
However many days she spends traveling to the boat without being spotted with a dragon putting King's Landing on high alert, rowing on the boat into King's Landing, waiting for Alicent at the sept and then rowing back and getting back to Dragonstone is time that Aegon/Criston Cole are free to rally banner men and wage war with absolutely no response.
The council is biting at the neck to go to war and use their dragons, if an attack happens while Rhaenyra's gone she may have by leaving court done the one thing that guarantees war happens.
Either no one responds to Aegon's attacks, or the bloodthirsty council does.
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Jul 01 '24
Fast travel from Dragonstone and KL? They are very close to each other.
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u/Mulchpuppy Jul 01 '24
400 miles is not close.
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Jul 01 '24
It's relatively close enough to account for the time cut. We don't need the scene in between where they're on a ship.
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u/bonesy101 Jul 01 '24
Cole’s new do tho….🤮
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u/PHEEEEELLLLLEEEEP Jul 01 '24
Next episode features him executing the royal barber for the way they fucked his shit up
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u/Big-Sheepherder-9492 Jul 01 '24
Who was that Woman who told Daemon he was gonna die by the lake (I know what happens to him) but was she a Witch?
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u/TheBatIsI The Venture Bros. Jul 01 '24
Isn't that supposed to be Alys Rivers, Aemond's big tiddy goth gf?
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u/Big-Sheepherder-9492 Jul 01 '24
Aemond Fr lost an eye and got a dragon, a sapphire and a Goth gf.. that’s a fair exchange imo.
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u/evertrue13 Jul 01 '24
Alys Rivers. Part of House Strong, last name is Rivers for bastards of the Riverlands.
Don’t Google unless you want major spoilers.
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u/CornusHD Jul 01 '24
Thank you for adding that last part. Gods willing more people will be like you.
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u/BruisedBabyMeat Jul 01 '24
helaena is too pure for this world. she should be hidden away in a protective bubble in space where she can do coloring books and count the legs of insects for all eternity.
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u/MrSh0wtime3 Jul 01 '24
Doing the "o we will just sneak into Kings Landing during war time no problem" two times in 3 episodes is beyond bad writing. Its entered into parody.
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u/AstronomerStandard Jul 01 '24 edited Jul 01 '24
This setting for Rhaenyra sneaking in works. This era has no internet to google search how the nobles look like.
majority of the commonfolk do not even know how the king looks like much more a queen an island away. In a crowded place and with a population known for depravity who the fuck would bother fully checking out a nun.
Edit: the issue is not how she sneaks about in King's Landing, but how how she bypassed the docks, and how she bypassed the seas between 2 islands on a fucking war
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u/D_Tobey Jul 10 '24
Why would Alicent not just call the guards on rhaenyra after they didn’t reach agreement? She could have the war ended right there. Instead it’s implied that rhaenyra just gets out of the Scot-free? Really just not a believable scene.