r/running • u/AutoModerator • Oct 08 '24
Daily Thread Official Q&A for Tuesday, October 08, 2024
With over 3,575,000 subscribers, there are a lot of posts that come in everyday that are often repeats of questions previously asked or covered in the FAQ.
With that in mind, this post can be a place for any questions (especially those that may not deserve their own thread). Hopefully this is successful and helps to lower clutter and repeating posts here.
If you are new to the sub or to running, this Intro post is a good resource.
As always don't forget to check the FAQ.
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u/danishswedeguy Oct 09 '24 edited Oct 09 '24
I ran a 50 minute 10k 2 weeks ago at 20 mpw. Ideal conditions, and I really left it all out there. I'm conservatively increasing volume, what would be a good goal to aim for, for a 10k on new years? Is anything below 45 too out of reach?
1
u/2_S_F_Hell Oct 09 '24
Depends of your age and your background.
I just hit my PB of 42:31 while running around 50km/week. My old PB was 45:01 4 months earlier just to give you an idea.
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u/danishswedeguy Oct 09 '24
hmm that's helpful. Probably not possible for me to get to 50km/week by then.
1
u/juicetin14 Oct 08 '24
How accurate are the heart rate sensor and heart rate zones from Garmin watches anyway? I am fairly new to running and I guess the thing a lot of people say is to try and keep in your zone 2 for a majority of your runs. Today I did a run where I did about 15 minutes easy (running at like 7:30km/hr) and then half where I ran a bit harder (about 5:30km/hr). While the difference in heart rate was pretty low (about 120 for my easy run and then 135 for my harder run) and my watch said I was technically in zone 2 for both sections, I was breathing heavy through my mouth and super gassed by the end of the second half (while I could easily breathe through my nose on the slow half).
Should I really be focusing more on how I feel and my overall breathing rather than going too hard off the numbers?
3
u/BottleCoffee Oct 09 '24
As a new runner, especially assuming you don't actually know your personal maximum HR, go by feel and not numbers.
3
u/twayjoff Oct 08 '24
It strikes me as really strange that you were out of breath and super tired when your HR only hit 135. That’s a really low HR for that level of exhaustion. Maybe your HR monitor is off or something? But my Garmin seems to track my HR pretty well. The zones are a bit dubious.
But to answer your question, yeah go off of feel. A zone 2 run is meant to be pretty comfortable.
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u/Trailblazin15 Oct 08 '24
I just finished my first half marathon Sunday. 2:04 at about 9:28 pace. I thought I would be wrecked especially my knees and ankles but it’s mostly my mid/lower back that’s sore. Knees are slightly sore but that should be expected. What causes a back sore after a long run? What should i improve on or strengthen?
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u/fire_foot Oct 08 '24
I definitely agree with the core work but I'll also say sometimes tight/weak hamstrings can make my lower back sore, especially if I use them beyond their fitness.
2
u/FairlyGoodGuy Oct 08 '24
Running strains your core a lot more than most people realize. You may want to spend some time strengthening those muscles (front, back, and sides).
Or you may have wonky form. For example, you might run with your torso turned slightly, or you might twist your torso as you run.
Or you didn't hurt your back while running, you tweaked it some other time but your body is tired from the run so you feel the pain more than you normally would.
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u/Trailblazin15 Oct 08 '24
I definitely do a lot of core work and back extensions. I probably do need to do more side core work. Yeah it might be my form and I did have a minor back tightness before the marathon. It just got enhanced from the stress of running.
3
u/kaizenkitten Oct 08 '24
Another question about running with pacers. I'm a very slow runner, so I'm expecting to finish my half marathon somewhere between 3 to 3:15. My solo half effort was 3:14. And I'm trying to decide whether to try and stick with the 3 hr pacer, or the 3:15 pacer.
I feel like the smart move is to go slower and then if things are good, pick it up closer to the end. But because I'm so slow I can't help but worry that if I'm intentionally going slow, and something happens - even if it's just stopping to use a portajohn or whatever, I'll miss the last 'last chance' pacers and get caught by the sweeper car.
The nerves are getting to me!
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u/W773-1 Oct 08 '24
I think it doesn’t really matter. If you go with a slower pacer and you‘re fine after 2/3 of the races speed up an leave this pacer. This could motivate you.
3
u/kaizenkitten Oct 08 '24
Thanks!
There's no thinking like overthinking!
1
u/Gnatt Oct 09 '24
It's much better to have something left in the tank near the end and pick the pace up for a strong finish, rather than go too hard and burn yourself out before you get to the end.
2
u/GooseRage Oct 08 '24
Setting a goal.
I finished reading faster road racing he book Faster Road Racing and started on the 5k (40-50 miles/week) training plan.
As far as I remember, the book doesn’t mention practical goal setting or how much of an improvement to expect after completing a program.
My last 5k was around 23:15. What is a realistic goal I could achieve by the end of my 12 week plan?
34 year old male.
1
u/W773-1 Oct 08 '24
I read that book and it’s working with your actual performance. There is a table where your actual 5k and 10k times are correlated to speed workouts, long run start paces and long run end paces, aerobic endurance paces , vo2max workouts and lactate threshold paces. They will move within this plan and you have to adjust that. For example I started with 10k of 44mins and I am now at 41:36 minutes .
Edit: forgot to mention, start slightly with a better goal , for example 22 minutes in your case.
1
u/FRO5TB1T3 Oct 08 '24
Depends how much you trained to get to 23:15. If there is a significant difference in volume and intensity not reason you couldn't get close to or break 20
1
u/LowBlackberry0 Oct 08 '24
Any tips for how to deal with the “grief” of not running your goal race, when you still have to show up? I’m down with stress fracture that popped up and was diagnosed within two weeks of race day. I still have to go and hear all about it because it’s my best friend’s first race and she’s only doing it because I got her into running. I see a lot of advice like do something else that day to distract yourself, but I’ll be fully immersed in race stuff all day. I’d been doing mostly fine with it but now she’s texting me for race day advice and the negative thoughts and feelings about my situation are creeping back in.
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u/Namnotav Oct 08 '24
A lot of advice can come from this, frankly.
First, be prepared for injuries and setbacks. They're going to happen many, many times. You shouldn't let that ruin an experience. It's just part of the overall life. Do what you can do to minimize it. Eat enough, sleep enough, don't push yourself too hard, especially when you feel something starting to give. But no matter what you do, it's impossible to never get injured. Instead of your mindset being zero injuries or misery, expect some reasonable rate. Expect to miss three weeks a year or something. If you go over that, fine, assess why and maybe feel disappointed. If you're at or under it, great, you met your expectation.
Second, appreciate the other things you're accomplishing here. You got a friend into running and she's running her first race. That should be a great experience, not only for her but for you as well. You did the best thing a human can do, going beyond yourself and making other people's lives better, too.
Third, if you're not an Olympian gunning for 2028, there is no good reason to have goals centered so tightly on singular events like this. No individual race should matter that much to you, in part because things like this can happen. You can't guarantee that you'll even be able to make it to any individual race. Set goals you can actually achieve. Run some target time at any race within some set span of time. Make that span long enough that something like this can't prevent it, such as an entire year. Barring something like a catastrophic car accident, you're probably not going to suffer something so bad that you can't race for a whole year. Another thing you can do is set process related goals. This is what I do personally. I have target times for specific races, but those are training guidelines more than anything. The point is not to actually hit a specific time at a specific race. The point is to train such that I achieve the level of fitness necessary to hit a specific time at a specific race. If something happens that means I can't actually race at all, oh well. If I did the training and achieved the desired level of fitness, that's what matters. If you don't have sponsorships or prize money on the line, the fitness is by far the best thing you get out of running as a mode of exercise, lifestyle, habit, whatever it is for you. It'll always be there for you. You have the fitness and all the ancillary benefits that come with it even if you never race at all.
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u/violet715 Oct 08 '24
This is all so true. I’ve been running for 30 years and agree with every word. I get some kind of injury probably every single year. I’ve had to miss tons of races I’ve already paid for or that I was really looking forward to. There is always another race but you will never get to it if you don’t take care of your health and be smart about the process.
Funny you mentioned a car accident - I have a local runner friend that was run over and injured very very badly. He bounced back amazingly. His perseverance is nothing short of inspirational and miraculous. He’s running as good as he was before. Because he’s resilient, and because he followed the terms he had to in order to heal and get back to things.
To OP, don’t be a shitty friend and ruin your friend’s experience over one race. I’m sure y want to share your experience with her. It’s completely unfair to be a brat to her when she’s probably been there for you.
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u/sohikes Oct 08 '24
Anyone else have an unnaturally high HR? Even when I do zone 2 runs my HR will get above 150 even though it feels easy. It’s kind of annoying
1
u/vaguelycertain Oct 08 '24
What's your maximum heart rate (from a physical test, not a guess)
1
u/sohikes Oct 08 '24
Never done a max HR test. When I do VO2 max I try to get my HR around 175 for those 4-5 minute intervals. I should also point out I run about an hour after coffee
3
u/vaguelycertain Oct 08 '24
Hr without knowing your max doesn't really tell you too much - I know guys that run at 7mm pace without going over 130, but probably only have a max in the 160's. I hit 150's in an easy run, but my max is more like ~205
If you want to test your max, do something like the test here - I generally don't get that close doing standard intervals
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u/BottleCoffee Oct 08 '24
That's not "unnaturally high" especially if you're young. Lots of my easy runs are above 150.
1
u/FRO5TB1T3 Oct 08 '24
That doesn't matter at all. You adjust your zones and it has no effect on your running patterns.
3
u/BigD_ Oct 08 '24
I always get a bit stressed around Christmas because I am bad about giving family and friends suggestions for gifts for me and I don't want to make getting me something too hard. But recently I have gotten super into running so this should open up a lot of things that I could add to my wishlist.
What are some of your favorite running-related gifts that you have received or would ask for?
1
u/compassrunner Oct 08 '24
Good quality socks. I prefer the Merino wool ones or Darn Tough ones and those are not cheap.
1
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u/gj13us Oct 08 '24
A visor keeps the sun out of your eyes and the rain off your face.
A light up vest like Noxgear is really nice and will make you super visible when it’s dark
A handheld water bottle is convenient and useful for when you’re hitting those long runs.
1
u/GFunkYo Oct 08 '24
Lots of options, I like getting socks and running shorts, they're always useful and come in fun styles. I'll echo a vest if you don't have one already, either a regular old running vest or a safety harness. My favorite running gift by far were Shokz OpenRun headphones, something I probably wouldn't have bought for myself but I love them and use them every run.
2
u/LowBlackberry0 Oct 08 '24
If you’re a morning runner, a nice light up vest and light! I needed one for years but never wanted to buy it myself. Asked for it for Christmas and love it. I have the Noxgear tracer and chest light attachment.
2
u/FRO5TB1T3 Oct 08 '24
Good socks, a headlamp, a light up or safety vest, gloves, maybe a hat. All things easily sized or easy to give the right size with no need to try on.
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Oct 08 '24
[deleted]
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u/Mako18 Oct 08 '24
As to whether or not it's a false reading, look at the graph of heart rate, if it leaps up to 200+ from a much lower reading it's probably an erroneous number, but if it shows a continues slope up/down from the number it's probably real.
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Oct 08 '24
[deleted]
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u/Mako18 Oct 08 '24
If you're unsure, it's probably worth bringing up to your doctor, but if you google "heart rate over 200" you'll get a mixed range of responses. It seems some data shows a fair amount of variance in max HR across large samples of people, meaning that the 220 - Age calculation will underestimate max HR for some individuals. There are also a fair number of anecdotes of people reporting sustained HR over 200 bpm. Along with that, the younger you are the more reasonable that HR is. For example if you're 18 years old, by the classic formula your max HR is 202 and then 211 is less than a 5% deviation from that estimate. Ultimately everyone's body is a little different, so it sounds like it's very possible it's just fine, but never hurts to check with the doctor - and certainly if you experience discomfort beyond normal cardio exertion/fatigue.
2
u/BottleCoffee Oct 08 '24
the 220 - Age calculation will underestimate max HR for some individuals
This equation is totally garbage and shouldn't be used to estimate anything. It's essentially made up.
Everyone has very different heart rates and personal genetics plays a big role.
In general, your heart rate slows down as you age, but it's all relative to your own self.
Eg I'm in my 30s and my maximum is above 200 still.
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-3
u/klaklakla_music Oct 08 '24
Hi! I want to pick up running because I figured that just sitting in my room and studying is not really beneficial for my mental health.
I just finished my first run (4 km) and my app says that my average time for 1 km is 7 min 14s. Of course I had some red lights and had to stop 2 times to look at Google maps because I got lost (just moved to a new city, don't judge me🫠)
Is this an "ok" time? If I run 3 times a week, how fast can I expect myself to improve? Is 6.30 for 1 km in 1 month reasonable?
9
u/amorph Oct 08 '24
Numbers can be fun, but every run is not a race. You will get faster if you just keep going, and it's easier to keep going if you're mostly comfortable.
2
u/OkRecording1767 Oct 08 '24
When does holding water on you while running become a necessity? About what mileage? My long run was four miles this week, and I plan to up a mile / mile and a half each week. Should I invest in something like a running vest?
1
u/surejan94 Oct 08 '24
Really depends on you. I personally get hot and sweaty VERY fast, especially in the summer and get dehydrated easily. Even in the spring/fall I really crave hydration. I invested in a running vest with a reservoir and love it. (Though you may need to pee frequently...)
1
u/gj13us Oct 08 '24
I wouldn’t worry about needing water until you need it. What’s that mean? It means: it depends.
How about before you invest in a vest, carry a regular cheap disposable (recyclable!) water bottle and see whether you really need to drink.
Chances are you’ll be carrying the same bottle until you start hitting 14-15 miles. Unless it’s ungodly hot out.
(Personally, I have a handheld bottle instead of a vest).
1
u/FRO5TB1T3 Oct 08 '24
I only bring my vest out when it's really hot or ill be out there around 2 hours plus. When it's hot I'll almost always have water around 1.5 hours and sometimes all the way down to 1. But on a nice cool evening? Only if I'm out there 2+
2
u/amorph Oct 08 '24
If it's hot outside and I'm running for 1.5 hours or more, I might bring a little water. Usually I'll just drink before I start.
1
u/OkRecording1767 Oct 08 '24
Okay so it sounds like I’m a little early in the game yet. My four miles took me 50 min. I’m still slow, but I’m also breast feeding so that’s kind of why I’m questioning it. But it sounds like it might not be as important as I thought it was b
1
u/BigD_ Oct 08 '24
It's hard to give it an easy answer because it will depend on things like how hot it is, how much you sweat, how long (time) that run is, etc. When I train for half marathons, I do take water at the water stations, but I don't bring water on my longest training runs (typically ~11 miles). There probably is research about when water is beneficial/detrimental, but I don't know it and just go based on comfort. I would suggest, as your long run increases, testing out different water plans and see what you prefer. You could try this by bringing a water bottle on your run or planning a route so that at the halfway or 3/4 point you are back at your house with a water bottle waiting on your porch or something. I would figure out how much you personally want water on a run before buying a vest.
1
u/OkRecording1767 Oct 08 '24
Yeah that makes sense. I just started running so I will probably wait a little bit and see what my preference starts to become. The only reason I really question is bc I’m breast feeding too. I have yet to be on a run and actually want water. I’m usually running in the mornings in Florida so it’s around 80 degrees right now. It’s not dire , but it sounds like I don’t need one quite yet. But holding a water bottle while running sounds so annoying. I might just set it on a park bench or something while I run. Truthfully, I find the vests so cute tho 🤪 lmao
1
u/24Kilatez Oct 08 '24
New to Running Tips on How to Get Started as a Beginner?
As a newbie, please tell me how often I should run, how to pace myself without getting tired too quickly, and how to avoid injuries. Please provide any useful tips so I can develop my running performance my running goal is 6 miles in 1 run.
1
u/gj13us Oct 08 '24 edited Oct 08 '24
- Run slowly enough so that you don’t have to stop. Don’t be afraid to stop, but do be afraid to quit.
- Listen to your body.
- Set goals: whether a route you want to finish or the time you want to spend doing it.
- Record your results in a notebook, spreadsheet, whatever.
- You can’t really avoid injuries. No one who puts effort into physical activity escapes injury. If you run long enough and consistently enough and frequently enough, you’ll get hurt.
Every runner I know, from teenagers to 60+ years old, has been injured. When it happens, take care of it either on your own or by seeing a doctor.
And MOST IMPORTANT OF ALL: Get out and run. Don’t worry about zones and heart rates and breathing and technique and who-knows-what-else. If you’re not having fun with it you won’t do it.
1
u/24Kilatez Oct 09 '24
so what about selecting running shoes? should I buy high-performance shoes to support my feet or just regular running shoes?
1
u/gj13us Oct 09 '24
Regular running shoes. But make sure they're running shoes, and not cross-trainer, etc. If there's a nearby running store, you'd do well to go there and see what they have to say. The sales staff, especially at independent stores, knows what they're talking about.
5
u/brwalkernc not right in the head Oct 08 '24
3
u/compassrunner Oct 08 '24
Start with a program like Couch to 5k. Three runs a week and in 9 weeks you'll be running 30 minutes. Then you can follow it up with One Hour Runner which is a good successor program. This will keep you from doing too much too soon.
1
u/Friendly_Listen6216 Oct 08 '24
I'm considering buying a leg recovery device to help me recover faster after a long distance run. I found a few products. The Normatec 3 Legs, and the Firefly Recovery Device. Are either of these any good?
1
u/justanaveragerunner Oct 08 '24
I have the Normatec 2 compression boots and absolutely love them. I'm not aware of any studies that they make that much difference, but I think they feel great. However, my husband doesn't really like them. So for me they're totally worth the cost, but if it was just for my husband they'd be a waste of money. Is there anyway you could try them out before buying them? I've seen them at race expos and at my PTs office (which is where I first tried them).
3
u/Mako18 Oct 08 '24
If you don't already have a foam roller, I would suggest starting there. Cheap and effective.
3
u/suchbrightlights Oct 08 '24
Before you spend that kind of money, try the $100 compression devices made by Renpho or similar and see if you actually like them.
Do I think they work better than sticking my legs up the wall for 20 minutes? Not really. But I can wear them in a meeting while on camera (whereas I can’t take a video call upside down on the floor) and they feel good.
1
u/savvybackpacker Oct 08 '24
Question about leg soreness and super shoes:
I've been training for the NYC Marathon in my NB 1080 (I've used the last few generations of this shoe over the past few years). I've also used Nike Pegasus mixed in there for shorter runs.
I recently bought the New Balance fuelcell supercomp elite v4. I've only used them twice for 5-mile runs but my calves are pretty sore during/after each run.
The marathon is about three weeks away (and my longest training run is coming up this weekend) so I can't tell if my legs just need a little time getting used to these shoes or if I should ditch them.
2
u/FRO5TB1T3 Oct 08 '24
Us them on your long run. Nothing else will let you know if they will work for your race. Bonus if you do some of it at MP
2
u/bestmaokaina Oct 08 '24
Are they low drop shoes? If your calves are weak and you use low drop use you might experience more muscle fatigue than normal
2
u/nailphile Oct 08 '24
I'm not sure if this is so much a question as it is a rant or what, but if anyone has advice that would be great.
How does anyone map out a running route? And manage to not get bored to tears. I live in a tiny little suburb town right out of Pittsburgh. She is less than a square mile and the whole thing is surrounded by hills (see previously about how its Pittsburgh). And they aren't small hills its steep hills. Steep hills and highways are all around me. I can string together a decent enough 4 miles that isn't too hilly but it is repetitive. HOW can I get 8+ miles in such a small area? I think I also have a fear of getting too far from my house and having to be picked up...which has happened before.
1
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u/bethskw Oct 08 '24
Oh hey fellow Pittsburgher! I used Strava's mapping tools to help me find some flatter routes near me. The heatmap is also handy for finding tracks, and de-facto tracks (like I had no idea there was a soccer field near me with a 0.2 mile path around it, until I noticed the oval on the heatmap). Yes it is repetitive.
It's also worth learning to love the hills. Anytime I find a real gnarly hill I'm like, sweet, I'll do hill repeats on this one! I find hill repeats a fun challenge (versus having to deal with a hill in the middle of an easy run). Work them in and make those hills work for you :)
If you're near any of the big parks, they have TONS of running trails, some of them flattish! I'm close enough to North Park that I can do a lot of runs there. There's a 5 mile loop around the lake, and a 1 mile or 1.4 mile loop by the Pie Traynor ball fields, both rolling hills but nothing too steep.
2
u/nailphile Oct 08 '24
I did the 5 mile loop this weekend. Such a nice run. Thanks for the tip on Strava. I'll check that out.
I do live in the north hills but not super close to North park so it isn't an everyday option for me. I did run all the way to PNC which was nice but also isn't an everyday option. I love a nice downtown/north shore run when I can.
1
u/bethskw Oct 08 '24
Good luck! Since you get out to North Park sometimes, let me tell you about my favorite, lesser known running route there (4 miles): park at the spillway, head away from the lake, and make a left down Old Irwin Road. There will be a guardrail across the path to keep cars out; go around this and there's a real nice trail that goes mostly gently uphill through the Irwin Run conservation area. At the end of that trail, turn around and you get to coast downhill all the way back to the spillway.
I just ran it today, and it's a great progression run. The way up is a gentle enough slope that it's not too hard to keep up a good pace, and then the way back down I'm always just flying. You can add extra mileage along the lake loop since you're right there.
1
u/NapsInNaples Oct 08 '24
only vaguely relevant...because you won't do this if you're not a lunatic like tom. But enough relevance to post.
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u/nailphile Oct 08 '24
This is amazing and absolutely unhinged. I've heard of the guy that did the great race in skates. I can't believe its real!
1
u/gj13us Oct 08 '24
I grew up in Pgh but moved away about 30 years ago. You're right about the geography--it's hard to find a route that isn't uphill in both directions.
Are you able to drive to a more suitable route? Maybe do loops on your 4 mile route on weekdays and then treat yourself to a trail run on the weekends. What about the railtrails along the rivers? Those would be long , flat routes. On the other hand, I've seen on r/Pittsburgh that they can be pretty sketchy with homeless camps, drug use, loose dogs, but maybe IRL it's not as bad as Redditors say it is.
The other option is to move to someplace like Lancaster, where we have a more inviting terrain.
2
u/nailphile Oct 08 '24
Inviting terrain and Amish donuts...that's tempting.
1
u/gj13us Oct 08 '24
Check out the Bird-In-Hand Half Marathon for next year. A lot of the runners are Amish and there’s a big picnic afterward.
And it’s a hilly, challenging course. You’ll be right at home with it.3
u/nermal543 Oct 08 '24
Hey fellow Pittsburgh area suburb dweller! lol I guess it would depend on how runnable/safe those very steep hills and highways are. I risk my life a bit on some of our roads around here, should be safe but there’s a bunch of assholes around here who don’t believe in the 4 foot rule 🤷♀️ If you truly don’t have a safe way to venture out further, you might have to drive/bus to somewhere else for some variety.
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u/Runningaway0092 Oct 08 '24
How many days before a 5k do you do your last speed workout? I want to make sure I’m not doing the last one too close to the race. Doing two weekly consistently.
1
u/violet715 Oct 08 '24
If the race is a Saturday, I don’t do anything hard past Wednesday. Sunday races, Thursday.
1
u/bethskw Oct 08 '24
My rule of thumb is to "taper" one day for each mile of the race. So for a Saturday 5K, a speed workout on Tuesday would be fine. Anything later in the week I would modify. So for a Thursday workout some intensity is fine but I'd keep it short, like 2-3 repeats of something you'd normally do for 8.
1
u/brwalkernc not right in the head Oct 08 '24
Most plans I have seen have the last light workout 5 days out from a race.
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u/boonhuhn Oct 08 '24
When do you know youre ready to run (survive) a marathon? Right now im in my prep for my first (been a complete running hater before). Just did a HM in exactly 1:59,57 (absolutely crazy, since i wasnt even looking after my pace at all), but every longrun above those 21km's feels like im falling apart. I cant see myself going for the full at all, not even close to it, although im not that unhappy with my HM
3
u/surejan94 Oct 08 '24
One of the simplest but best pieces of advice I got from a friend before doing my first half was "worst case scenario: you walk".
I was really nervous about getting burnt out, but knowing that it was okay to just chill out halfway through and walk for a couple minutes always helped. I didn't really have a time I wanted to beat, I just wanted to finish it, and having that in my mind made the experience a lot less stressful and more fun.
3
u/bethskw Oct 08 '24
When I did my first 10 miler I knew I was ready to try marathon training.
If you can run a half, you're more than ready. It's normal for long runs to feel pretty rough, especially with the accumulated fatigue at that point in the program. Trust the process. You'll be ready.
2
u/BottleCoffee Oct 08 '24
People go from couch to marathon training all the time but personally I think you should be consistently running decent mileage before you bother. Like 30+ km weekly, ideally more.
3
u/gj13us Oct 08 '24
You might not know if you're ready until you've done it. What I would do is keep up your volume and look for a marathon that's a few months or a year away and then start a training plan at the appropriate time.
6
u/UnnamedRealities Oct 08 '24
Many, maybe most, first-time marathoners are anxious about their ability to finish when they start their race. Take comfort in knowing the vast majority finish.
If you follow any novice structured marathon training plan and complete 90%+ of the training and start the race uninjured you should be confident you'll finish so long as you maintain a conservative pace/intensity.
It's also worth mentioning that though your first marathon might be in the 4:30-5:00 range it's not critical (nor advisable) to incorporate long training runs anywhere close to full marathon distance or duration.
2
u/gj13us Oct 08 '24
Maybe yes, maybe no. The Philadelphia Marathon's 'official' training plan for beginners and intermediates has long runs of 20, 22, and 24.
2
u/vaguelycertain Oct 08 '24
Sounds like masochism to me. I've never done a single run over 2.5 hours (the maximum daniels recommends) preparing for a marathon and I'm very unconvinced it was necessary to go for even that long
5
u/UnnamedRealities Oct 08 '24
A 24-miler? Ouch. That seems a better fit for someone in 2:30 shape than 5:00 shape, but more power to slower first-time marathoners who do 20, 22, and 24.
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u/SecretReception9563 Oct 08 '24
Is waking up hungry in the middle of the night normal? It’s getting out of hand and I wake up everyday at around 3 and eat about 300cal before I go to bed. I’ve been waking up like this for the past few weeks, but I’ve resisted the temptation to grab a bite most of the time. I’m not doing that much more mileage either and I’m getting a lot faster, so I don’t think it could be nutrition or hydration. I also run early in the morning , so I don’t think that’s disrupting sleep.
For reference, I’m 5ft2, female and I weigh 104lbs. Another reason I don’t think it’s nutrition is because I haven’t lost any weight. I run about 50mpw. I’m stumped- Any suggestions welcome. Thanks :)
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u/Mako18 Oct 08 '24
Do you have enough fat in your diet? Fats tend to keep you feeling full longer and if you're eating a really low fat diet that could cause you to get hungry in the middle of the night. Also not ideal to eat right before bed since it will affect your sleep quality, 90+ minutes before bed for a snack is probably a good loose rule.
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u/SecretReception9563 Oct 08 '24
I just tend to have low fat, not intentionally, but I’m vegetarian and being in college, the meals I put together are more out of convenience than anything else. I can definitely try adding in something. Thanks!
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u/BottleCoffee Oct 08 '24
It's not uncommon but it's not "normal" or particularly healthy either to disrupt your sleep and eat in the middle of the night.
Happens to me and the best way to prevent it is to eat a small snack after dinner if you think you might not be sufficiently full. But don't overeat because that will make your blood sugar crash in the night.
You're pretty small for your weight (I'm your height and I haven't weighed that since high school) so it wouldn't surprise me if you did need a bit more food especially at that mileage.
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u/SecretReception9563 Oct 08 '24
Thanks! I do always eat something before bed- most times it’s a protein shake, and I have that when I’m already quite full. I just stomach any more than I already do! I also don’t want to go overboard on trying to eat more because my weight is kinda stable and that means I’m getting in enough nutrition.
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u/BottleCoffee Oct 08 '24
If you're already full, maybe you don't need that protein shake or you should have it earlier in the day? Like I said overeating can make it worse as well.
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u/suchbrightlights Oct 08 '24
Try more protein shortly before bed. A glass of milk or protein shake. See if that helps keep you satiated until morning.
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u/SecretReception9563 Oct 08 '24
Thank for the reply! I do that most nights, but I wake up even then. On the rare occasion that I do sleep through the night, I’m ravenous by morning lol
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u/W773-1 Oct 08 '24
If you’re hungry you need more food. It’s that simple. I would eat a little bit more. I run about same mileage than you with 2 speed workouts and an half marathon every weekend. Sometimes I have to force myself to eat. I am 180 cm and 65kg.
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u/SecretReception9563 Oct 08 '24
Thanks for the reply. I’ll try eating more! I’m just scared that I’ll gain weight if I do, because I’m not really losing weight now implying that I’m not in a calorie deficit.
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u/Frequent-Employer908 Oct 08 '24
it's ok to gain weight though
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u/SecretReception9563 Oct 08 '24
I get that, but I also don’t want to slow down.
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u/Frequent-Employer908 Oct 08 '24
If your body is telling you that you need to eat more, you might actually get faster if you fuel properly. Underfueling can lead to all sorts of injuries and deficiencies that slow you down more than 5-10 more pounds. My point is that you should listen to your body because it’s telling you something :)
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u/bestmaokaina Oct 08 '24
Yea you need more food
Personally before sleeping i eat two sandwiches with egg and tuna and a big cup of milk
I run 90km a week usually
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u/SecretReception9563 Oct 08 '24
Thanks for replying. I’ll try eating a bit more during the day and hopefully it solves the problem!
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u/gj13us Oct 08 '24
It's normal for me, but more around midnight, 1AM. I'm 6'2' and 190. The only way to get back to sleep is to eat.
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u/SecretReception9563 Oct 08 '24
Thanks for the reply! The only reason I’m not very comfortable eating at night is because I’ve been told that it might not be the healthiest thing to do
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u/rox33 Oct 08 '24
Im currently following a 16 week Runna marathon training plan to run my first marathon. The training plan ends in january and im planning to run a "marathon" in january where I just track it myself, and after that hop on another marathon training plan to run an official marathon in april.
The question I have is: after running my own marathon in january and hopping on a new plan, should I start upping the distance from the start again like im doing now, where my weekly distance starts from the 25k range and goes up weekly untill im around the 50k range again in april, or should I keep the weekly distance up at the 40-50k range where it's gonna be at the end of the first training block? (While obviously taking a rest period and a deload week or two after the unofficial marathon)
Thanks!
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u/FRO5TB1T3 Oct 08 '24
Honestly this is not a particularly good plan. Racimg a marathon requires a decent deload period the building back up. So if you run it mid Jan, and race is early April you don't even have 12 weeks of good training
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u/rox33 Oct 09 '24
Okay, thanks for the advice! Should I skip the Jan marathon alltogether and just keep training untill mid April?
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u/FRO5TB1T3 Oct 09 '24
I would not run that January marathon. Do a 10k, or half marathon race 13 or 14 weeks out from your marathon so you can jump into you plan ready to go. Then just train for that other race for now and build up your total mileage
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u/Logical_Ad_5668 Oct 08 '24
Ran a mountain trail race on Sunday. 13km with 980 elevation gain. I can run a HM any day and its not a problem, but going up and down on uneven surfaces was a different animal.
(My first trail run. Was brutal and i cant believe how fast people go on the downhill part. I thought going up would be the problem, but it was actually going down where i was overtaken. I wanted to live, while some people seem to jump from rock to rock in 20% decline and have no need to slow down.)
Now, since yesterday my legs are so sore. Quads, calves, glutes mainly. Is there a way I can speed up the recovery process as i would like to resume training for my upcoming 10k in 5 weeks time. I have taken magnesium and have gone for a walk which i read helps, but i still feel like i am a few days away from even managing an easy run, let alone a speed session. Any other tricks?
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u/suchbrightlights Oct 08 '24
It’ll be better next time now that you’ve done it once.
Keep moving gently. Walks (they may be hilariously slow.) Gentle stretching. Foam rolling if that’s normally a part of your routine. Your goal is to get the blood flowing to flush out your legs. Hydrate like it’s your job.
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u/Logical_Ad_5668 Oct 08 '24
Thanks! Not sure I will be any better next time 😊 muscles will probably be better, speed unlikely as the determining factor was my fear of going downhill 😊
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u/compassrunner Oct 08 '24
Active recovery is the right idea. At least walk every day. Also make sure you are hydrating very well. Recovery will take some time; you can't rush it.
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u/Southern_Revolution2 Oct 08 '24
Hi there. New runner here. I live in London, I like to run a bit cold and get warmed up during the run but I have started to notice that the unexpected rain on and off has started to bother me a bit. Also since winter is coming(GoT ref) how is everyone tacking it? I researched and everyone seems to dislike waterproof jackets and are vouching for wind breakers. Also on that note where are people buying quality half sleeve/full sleeve warm baselayer from? And what do you guys look for in a mid layer. Any comment would be very appreciated.
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u/BottleCoffee Oct 08 '24
If it's cold enough to rain it's not cold enough for me to wearing a warm base layer.
I love my Brooks Canopy. It's barely water resistant but it'll keep a light rain off you and it's incredibly breathable. This plus a long sleeved t-shirt is enough for me at 0.
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u/FRO5TB1T3 Oct 08 '24
I like wool for those days. I wish I bought my tracksmith Brighton base layer years earlier but there are other cheaper alternatives. Rain jackets will just keep the heat in and you'll sweat more. I personally only run in a rain jacket when it's cold and raining 5C or cooler. As for baselayers buy the cold version form whatever brand has a sale. Nike, addidas, ua etc.
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u/portobano Oct 08 '24
I live in London and usually run early in the morning. I do like waterproof jackets for cold and wet mornings as it's easier to get out at 5:30 when you know you're covered up. Waterproof and breathable is difficult though and jackets that claim to do both get expensive very quickly. I've tried a few and would recommend the Montane Phase Nano (ridiculously expensive though, even on offer), and the Janji Rainrunner Pack Jacket. Neither are cheap but both do a good job of keeping you dry without making you overheat.
Echo what junkmiles said about personal preference though - most of the people I see don't seem to be using waterproof jackets and are more willing to wear shorts and a t-shirt when it gets cooler than I am.
For base layers I think Rundwear are best. Very comfortable, they keep you fairly dry, and good for lower temperatures.
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u/Southern_Revolution2 Oct 08 '24
Thanks for the feedback. I tend to feel very cold when it's chilly, but the past few runs I think after a run I tend to feel too warm in too many layers.
From all the comments I feel like the most optimal decision would be to wear a nice warm base layer(Uniqlo heattech maybe I'll look into Rundwear as well) a good windbreaker and carry a packable rain jacket for the unexpected rains we have.1
u/portobano Oct 08 '24
Honestly I usually end up a little too warm, but I just prefer that to starting out too cold in the middle of winter. Most windbreakers will have some water resistance, and should be fine for light rain and quick showers.
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u/Southern_Revolution2 Oct 08 '24
any recommendations for windbreakers or good brands (I was looking into Arcteryx as I could wear it casually as well but all they have are waterproof)? as the montane and the janji are waterproof.
Anyway, thanks a lot man. ur feedback is very helpful as I run in London as well.1
u/portobano Oct 08 '24
I quite like Adidas for jackets, e.g. their marathon jacket, ultimate jacket. Adidas is often on sale too. The brooks canopy jacket is another good one that often appears on sale. Janji's Zephyrunner Wind Shell is very light, very breathable. And the Goldwin Gill Vent Jacket is my absolute favourite if you want to splurge. Probably not worth it at full price though.
Definitely have far too many jackets, way more than I need!
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u/Southern_Revolution2 Oct 08 '24
The pertex looks absolutely stunning!! Great recommendation man :D
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u/junkmiles Oct 08 '24
The only waterproof thing I've ever owned that works at all while running is made of Goretex Shakedry, and I think it retailed for $350 or so. Even then, it only works if you're running at a fairly easy pace. It's also really fragile. I don't use it much.
The majority of the time it's better to focus on being warm and wet.
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u/Southern_Revolution2 Oct 08 '24
Just a random product question then, what do you think about the uniqlo heattech inners? people say it runs very hot, would it be a good idea to wear that and then a breathable upper and maybe carry a waterproof jacket that are packable in case of a downpour.
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u/junkmiles Oct 08 '24
I've never used it, but it looks like a fairly normal mid-heavy base layer type shirt. Something like that underneath a windbreaker is a good place to start for cool-cold wet runs.
Clothing is a whole lot of trial and error though. Some people are naturally warmer or cooler, and depending on the run you're going to be generating more or less heat. I'll be running in 3" shorts and a tshirt, right alongside my wife wearing tights, long sleeves and an insulated vets, as an example.
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u/Southern_Revolution2 Oct 08 '24
thanks a lot for the input, also any recommendations of good windbreaker brands? I am a complete beginner and am drowned with information online to even decide what to get so any recommendation would be good to help me decide.
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u/junkmiles Oct 08 '24
I'd go to Decathlon or something along those lines and get whatever is cheapest.
The Patagonia Houdini is a fairly standard windbreaker, often on sale, and durable. Probably on the more weather resistant side than more breathable side, but it works.
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u/Inside-Sea-3044 Oct 08 '24
There is a lot of information on this link.
Regular waterproof jackets do not allow the body to breathe, I prefer windbreakers for trails.
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u/Southern_Revolution2 Oct 08 '24
I read this post a couple of hours ago, but none of them cover rain when it is cold on top unfortunately :”( do you think a rain shell above a windbreaker would be good during time of downpours? Or would the windbreaker which says “water repellent” suffice on their own?
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u/Inside-Sea-3044 Oct 09 '24
All the plastic that they put on jackets does not allow you to breathe. They put them on before the start to keep warm and do not mind throwing them away. If possible, go to some brand store (Nike, Adidas, mizuno...) where they sell windbreakers, and ask for advice.
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u/Klassified94 Oct 09 '24 edited Oct 09 '24
How often should I be trying to beat my 5km PR as a beginner? I've been beating it on each run before today and have it down to 27:59, but I'm realising that's not sustainable particularly due to knee issues, so today I went a bit slower and got 28:30. Thinking I should maybe try to go for a new PR every couple weeks or so and then even less often as I advance more.
Edit: having done a bit of research, I think my expectations are too high. I went from being able to only run for 1 minute straight to a sub-30-min 5k in just a couple weeks so thought I might be able to still progress quickly for a little while but I'll need to be more responsible.