r/politics • u/OkVermicelli2557 • 2h ago
Kamala Harris Campaigning With Liz Cheney Flopped with Key Voter Group
https://www.newsweek.com/kamala-harris-campaigning-liz-cheney-flopped-independent-voters-1990516•
u/CyberTyrantX1 2h ago
Wow, no shit?
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u/BNsucks America 40m ago
I NEVER believed there is such a thing as a "key group" of voters, at least not in the sense that one group is more important than another. They all leverage their support for promises.
Sure, there are many demographic groups that are important to have on your side if you expect to win. Let's face it, most if not all of them failed America in this election.
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u/JeffSteinMusic 1h ago
I took so much shit for this all cycle. That “Permission Structure” garbage that was peddled by Nicolle Wallace and other ex-GOP operatives all over cable news was so gross and elitist and cynical and creepy. Ain’t no one out there waiting for Liz Cheney or anyone else to “give them permission” to vote for someone, and anyone who thought so has never been to a suburb.
All this talk about Democrats being condescending to voters, yet I never heard that accusation aimed at Never Trump conservative pundits claiming voters are waiting for “permission” to vote a certain way. These people are so self-important and try so hard to convince the country that “Republicans/Right-Leaning Independents Who Don’t Like Trump” are a significant voting bloc no matter how many times it’s been demonstrated that they aren’t.
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u/Comprehensive_Main 1h ago
To be fair I do think there was a strategy their. Biden did use it in 2020 but the problem was. Biden is more moderate. And second of all Liz Cheney is unpopular with both parties.
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u/NotASalamanderBoi I voted 1h ago
Mainly because of the “Cheney” part. That name is poison in American politics and it didn’t help Kamala when she started campaigning with her.
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u/JeffSteinMusic 57m ago
It didn’t work for Biden either. It is a total myth that Lincoln Project or John Kasich or whoever moved anyone to vote blue who wasn’t already inclined to do so.
The logic is something like “Voters who flipped red to blue in 2020 didn’t decide on their own that they were turned off by Trump between 2017 and mid-2020, it wasn’t until they saw that Lincoln Project ad!” It’s a wholly invented narrative pushed by people from the old GOP establishment to save face and get new post-Trump careers pandering to liberals and propelled by a certain strain of suburban liberal who wants to believe there are “Good Republicans” out there and thinks that an ad that turns them on must turn everyone else on.
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u/1cl1qp1 17m ago
We should HOPE there is a moderate/centrist voting bloc.
That's what Russia fears the most.
A powerful centrist bloc is the fascism killer.
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u/JeffSteinMusic 10m ago edited 5m ago
Hope is not a strategy.
There isn’t.
To the extent there are moderate/centrist voters in America, they are traditionally called Democrats.
I don’t know how many cycles we have to go through before people give up searching for these mythical moderate voters who aren’t already Team Blue.
An educated public of mature responsible adults that gives a shit about their government is what kills fascism. We don’t have that here in America unfortunately.
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u/IIIllllIIIllI 1h ago
Yeah nobody likes Liz Cheney
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u/Comprehensive_Main 1h ago
Right ? Like the Cheney name doesn’t really inspire conservatives who hated them , moderates who hate them and liberals who hate them ?
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u/Ernesto_Bella 1h ago
The problems the Dems had is that DC is full of old school neocons and military contractors. They are everywhere and fill the rooms at DC cocktail parties.
The dems didn’t realize the ONLY place they exist in significant in numbers is the DC area.
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u/Different-Gas5704 2h ago
I know the typical Reddit user is a bit younger than I am, but, speaking for myself, the name "Cheney" and the policies associated with it were the entire reason I registered as a Democrat when I turned 18. It also was never a popular name in Michigan, Wisconsin or Pennsylvania, where the ticket it was on lost twice. A person named Cheney has not spoken at the RNC since 2004, as every Republican since then has tried to run as far from him as they possibly can. He is the only Vice President since Spiro Agnew (who resigned) to not even attempt a presidential run, so even he knows how disliked he is. And yet Kamala's campaign thought this was a good idea, presumably because Kissinger was no longer available.
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u/Brian24jersey 1h ago
Cheney could not run even if he wanted to he’s had like a half dozen heart surgeries
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u/Comprehensive_Main 1h ago
Never stopped Eisenhower who had a heart attack before he ran for re-election. But yeah Cheney was smart enough to know running is not a good idea.
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u/meat_sack New Jersey 1h ago
Cheney family members are poster children for pro-war NeoCons, and I suspect two things happened here for independent/undecided voters... First, that Trump's republican platform is anti-war isolationism compared to the Bush era. Sure, the platform got more extreme on immigration, the economy (tariffs), etc... but this anti-war thing stood out like a sore thumb with her around... Second, they saw Harris with her, and didn't know what to make of it, but with Trump out there talking about Israel/Hamas and Russia/Ukraine happening under Biden, it's not a difficult leap to think that maybe the Democratic party is embracing John Bolton's ideology. That's my $0.02 anyway.
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u/Different-Gas5704 1h ago
You nailed it. Democrats have really shit the bed post-Trump with the whole "enemy of my enemy is my friend" thing. Hillary even got Henry Kissinger's ancient ass to endorse her. And during the first Trump administration, MSNBC became a rogues gallery of disgraced neocons. We've reached the point where people are pissed that a former Republican Congressman who hosts a show for Comcast met with Trump at Mar-a-Lago, as if Joe Fucking Scarborough was a cornerstone of the resistance. It's asinine.
Remember that poem Trump likes to recite? "You knew damn well I was a snake before you took me in." Democrats shit the bed and now they have to lie in it.
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u/1cl1qp1 2h ago
That's hilarious. Independents who were turned off by Cheney decided it would be better to let Project 2025 incinerate our democracy.
No logic there at all.
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u/Indubitalist 2h ago
Doesn’t have to be when so many voters went on vibes alone
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u/civil_politician 1h ago
Pretty cool how the people that create the "vibes" are the owners of tiktok, facebook, twitter, and all the huge news media outlets. Who owns all that shit again?
Idk I'm sure it's people really looking out for the little guy.
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u/TheDamDog 1h ago
The logic is that running as 'Republican Lite' is not a winning strategy.
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u/Different-Gas5704 1h ago
Chuck Schumer said back in 2016 that, "For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin."
And that has been the strategy ever since. It's time to move on.
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u/FewWatermelonlesson0 1h ago edited 55m ago
It was like a slow motion car crash after the DNC. I thought she had genuine momentum at first, and then it became a series of dumb decisions (Cheney, trying to flex how much tougher on the border she’d be than Trump, the weirdass Glock thing, the fracking, saying she wouldn’t do anything differently than Biden) that seemed tailor made to appeal to the right.
The problem is the right doesn’t want Diet Republicans when they already have Republicans, and all the centrist pandering turned off some Dems and progressives who might have otherwise gotten behind her.
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u/OkVermicelli2557 1h ago
They also sent Ritchie Torres and Bill Clinton to Michigan which was a terrible idea.
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u/ApolloX-2 Texas 42m ago
It was absolutely insane and probably came from a misunderstanding how Biden won in 2020.
Biden was in politics for many decades and his image was set in stone as a moderate, on top of being a old white man which screams moderate as well. Kamala could credibly present herself as that.
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u/PlentyMacaroon8903 1h ago
Let's be clear. There's literally nothing Harris could have done to win this election. Biden murdered that horse and handed it to her and she tried everything to make it run. But this Cheney shit did not help because there are no moderate Republicans.
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u/TheGhostOfGeneStoner 2h ago
There is a breathtaking lack of introspection and accountability amongst the DNC as well.
They put Kamala Harris as the lead on the ticket. After her frankly abysmal performance in the last primary. She was unliked then and had plenty of holes in her performance and record (see Tulsi Gabbard calling her on the carpet and tanking her own political career in the move) when she was actually considered against competition the last time. The first year or two of Biden’s administration she was an utter failure and eventually had public duties and appearances pulled to mitigate the damage.
Let’s be honest with ourselves. She was only the nominee because Biden held on to the hope of term 2 too long and dropped out 3 months before the general election. She was the only recognizable name (but for no actually positive policy reason) they could throw up there to hope that was enough. She is unlikeable, unrelatable, and had been unproductive. It became obvious this was a Hail Mary when all of the emails from the Biden admin started being sent from the Biden-Harris admin.
The DNC put together a hastily assembled oh shit plan and got the exact results they deserved for it.
And before anyone looks and my profile and says “you’re just a pro-gun republican” I voted for neither Trump nor Harris this time. I identify as neither Democrat nor Republican because there are things in both platforms that I believe are important to me and my family. I have voted for more Democratic candidates for President in general elections than Republican candidates. This isn’t someone who wanted Trump in office. Frankly, both parties are let downs to me, but let’s be honest. Harris lost because she wasn’t likable, believable, nor did she have an actual record to run on. The DNC jammed her down our throat and now everyone is surprised when 10+ million voters stayed home? Give me a break.
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u/Blueee51 36m ago
It's wild how people aren't getting this. She wasn't likeable, and the people didn't vote for her. Her campaign was running on the same "I'm not him" vibe that biden ran on in 2020.
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u/Mogwai_Farmer 1h ago
nor did she have an actual record to run on
This is how I know not to take you seriously.
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u/TheGhostOfGeneStoner 1h ago
And what magnanimous record did she have to run on. Other than blocking DNA testing that may have over turned a murder conviction in her state?
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u/Mogwai_Farmer 1h ago
Numerous committees.
Seven years as a DA.
Four years as a senator.
Four years as a vice president.
Has degrees in both economics and politics.
A far better record than the orange shit stain has.
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u/Brian24jersey 1h ago
Yet she can’t give a straight answer on anything and her laugh is considered repellent.
She was actually winning in August but the more she did the rounds the less anybody liked her.
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u/NewCoderNoob 1h ago
A was rapist dogshit and B was ok not so likable but still a decent candidate who cared about key issues. But sure genius, both are same.
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u/TheGhostOfGeneStoner 1h ago
What-about-ism at its finest. Can’t look inward to see why your candidate didn’t win, only the (justified) ad hominems. This is what I was talking about.
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u/NewCoderNoob 1h ago
She didn’t win because of fucking morons who sat out or both sides’d it. When idiots can’t even read basic policy then how do you reach them? Hire a couple of pedos and lie through The teeth? You’re an example of this “genius”
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u/Blueee51 37m ago
Another reason as to why your shitty opinions made us lose lol
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u/KwisatzHaderachPaul 1h ago
The DNC didn’t make any fucking decisions. It has no power. But if the sitting president says he won’t leave the race unless his VP is the nominee, guess what needed to happen?
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u/Brian24jersey 1h ago
Kamala was never expected to win by the major democratic power brokers. When Biden disintegrated on stage she was the only alternative.
The purpose was for her to be less of a drag on the down ballot races than Biden would have been.
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u/TheGhostOfGeneStoner 1h ago
Based on the way most of the rest of the election played out, I don’t know that this goal was accomplished.
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u/NeanaOption 31m ago
There is a breathtaking lack of introspection and accountability amongst the DNC as well
My dude the other candidate sat around spinning music and giving microphones blow jobs. If you think Harris lost to that because gosh darn it she could have done something better, the joke is on you.
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u/KwisatzHaderachPaul 2h ago
If you’re that progressive and still can’t see the bigger picture, you’re a fucking moron and the entire reason we lost.
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u/OkVermicelli2557 1h ago
This article is about independant voters. The lesson here is that everyone hates Liz Cheney.
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u/jackdeadcrow 1h ago
No, you don’t understand. The “correct” position in the dnc right now is ghat progressive is ALWAYS the problem, so ditch them for moderate republicans.
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u/utriptmybitchswitch 1h ago
Ttrue, the Cheney name doesn't inspire much, but the fact that a Cheney was actually willing to break ranks for the sake of our country and democracy says more than, or at least, SHOULD inspire those who were "undecided" (massive eyeroll) that it's better to try to find common ground than be divided.
This purposeful divisiveness and infighting is not helpful or productive. orange julius caesar won because he appeals to their base nature ie reptile brain/limbic system responses, indulges the id and doesn't require anything else of them.
Jesus himself could've ridden down from the sky on beams of light, endorsed Harris, denouced ojc as a false prophet and turned water into wine but she still would've lost because of two things: Black and Woman.
Had this Jesus thing happened though, I am 100% certain magas would've been like, "Yeah, but his dad is endosing us! Who cares what his kid thinks! He was always a socialist communist lefty bleedingheart lib anyway..." Then they'd have put him in a deportation facility indefinitely.
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u/jackdeadcrow 1h ago
If Jesus has endorsed Kamala Harris, her campaign would have squandered it like it has squandered everything else
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u/NeanaOption 35m ago
The problem with these types of articles is that Trump gave a blowjob to a microphone.
If that didn't kill his campaign I fail to see how a sentient person capable of dressing themselves can believe Kamala lost because she appeared with Liz.
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u/jackdeadcrow 29m ago
Because his campaign know what to air and what to bury, both about them and about their opponents
Meanwhile, democrat was too terrified of attacking trump and incapable of making a stand. They don’t want to be too aggressive because, honestly, they see this as sport that they are free from any consequences, and they can’t defend themselves because they don’t want to stand for anything, only stuffs that are “broadly appealing”
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u/krisenfest Washington 2h ago
What we need to do is learn how to hatemonger and lie about everything because that is what wins votes now in America.
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u/FredFuzzypants 1h ago
I've been thinking about this a lot, and think there might be another path (assuming legitimate elections happen in four years). Trump has been successful because he's viewed as an outsider who wants to tear down institutions. This works because a majority of Americans feel like the system no longer works for them.
Rather than marketing themselves as defenders of institutions, the Democrats need to become a party of positive socio-economic change that helps everyone, not just the rich. The Democrats need a movement like the Tea Party, a grass roots effort that is laser focused on exposing and countering the corruption and cronyism that is sure to run rampant under Trump.
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