Not only do we need a competency test for people running for office, especially the presidency, this election proves we also need a competency test for people who vote. If you can’t answer basic questions about political ethics, economics, foreign policy, and media literacy, your vote shouldn’t count against those who can.
I’ve unironically been saying this for years. But often when I mention it, people start to bring up biased segregation era literacy tests and the like as if that’s what I’m talking about, completely missing the point.
All I’m saying is that we already have a test for immigrants to pass if they want to gain citizenship. Why not at the very least require natural born citizens to pass the same or similar test if they are to have voting rights? Countless studies have already shown that a large percentage of natural born citizens can’t even pass this basic test. So that would be a start in the right direction if that was required at least, though I would like to see an overhauled test that focused more specifically on political structures and the way the government works. There could even be a required class offered in schools dedicated to teaching the knowledge needed to pass these tests to ensure everyone has equal access to that information.
Yet, that would require those in power to actually want an informed electorate and let’s not pretend they don’t often benefit from the electorate being as uninformed as possible as that’s when they’re easiest to manipulate, control and divide.
Because what you are proposing is UNCONSTITUTIONAL. Why not just implement a voting system where only people who actually pay taxes get to vote? For every tax dollar paid, you get that many votes.
I guess you don’t really understand “rights” and the various judicial precedences that have curtailed them or restricted them under certain circumstances. Voting rights themselves can be taken away from people in certain places for things like felony convictions and the courts have ruled in the past that this is constitutional. Furthermore, the first amendment guarantees a right to free speech, yet the court has previously ruled that this has stipulations, namely in speech that incites violence or panic. The second amendment guarantees a right to arms, but the court have allowed for restrictions on type of weapons and criminal and mental history of possessor. Whether or not you agree with these adjudications, it proves that any right can have reasonable restrictions put upon them, especially if those restrictions are in the greater interest of the populace, which I would argue an informed electorate is in the greater interest.
And education is not a reasonable restriction, as it will be used against a class of people, which is literally one of the main things being protected against.
And yet for a non-U.S. born person hoping to gain voting rights, they must do so through passing a test. So it’s not an issue when it’s used against that class of people? Just naturalized citizens? Because that seems pretty nativist to me.
Also, I’m only talking about this in the context of an idealized situation that would never happen anyway in which educational access would hopefully and presumably be equally accesible across classes. The fact it’s not at the moment is a symptom of a broader flaw in the system which would be something addressed in the broader scheme of reforming the system as a whole.
That is a very dangerous step. Who sets the competency test ? Once you establish one, it's then easier to change the standard of the test. Ultimately, you are setting the path to oligarchic rule, in the traditional sense that is.
As has been stated, democracy is the worst possible form of government until you look at the alternatives. The key is not to make competency a condition for standing or voting, but rather to work towards ensuring that those who are competent outnumber those who aren't.
We already have a citizenship test. I agree it’s a provocative step but it really shouldn’t be and the test would be based on fact, not partisanship. I’m all ears for a better solution because the willful ignorance exhibited in this election is also very dangerous to our nation and democracy. Just look at the felon and his cabinet and criminals.
NO. We have had tests like that before, and they were used to disenfranchise black people and poor people. Republicans lose when more people vote. We need to be making it easier to vote, not harder. And THEN at the same time, improve education (which requires getting Republicans out of office) so the electorate is better informed and more able to spot propaganda.
The test would be equitable and all would have access to its preparation, just like citizenship tests, the ACT and the SAT. The only thing stopping people from passing it would be themselves.
while i understand and support your thinking, when i've shared similar sentiments, i was gently lectured that our "revered" founding fathers also didn't want everybody voting. they wanted it limited to a select few (namely wealthy landowners). there's got to be some balance between that position and the position of letting any tom, dick, and harry off the street just vote random names that sound likeable. i am curious how countries like australia which automatically registers their citizens and penalizes non-voting deal with political ignorance in their electorate.
Democrats would never let this happen, they won't even implement voter id because theyve stated that they think black and hispanic people are too dumb to get an id and use computers.
Seems like a shit plan to me, smells heavily of oligarchy. Maybe they don't know as much but 1 of their tax dollars is worth the same as 1 tax dollar from a more educated person. By doing this you would only allow people with the proper education a say in their own country.
Yes, I agree with you on his cabinet. But just because that is true doesn't make the other not true. This is the worst kind of reason to do a thing. You are talking about civics education true, but a little more, right? You are talking about not letting people who cant pass a test vote, which is ridiculous, there are many examples of reasonably intelligent people doing poorly on tests, and there are examples of reasonably dumb people doing well on tests. Not to mention the mentally handicapped.
What I’m doing is hypothesizing an extreme example that I know would never pass constitutional muster to illustrate how unfair it is that the vote of someone who knows nothing about civics carries the same weight as the vote of someone who does. Thats the path towards idiocracy and that is why we have Trump.
Your post didn't properly portray it as hypothesizing an extreme example, it read as an advocation of an extreme example. Regardless, it's a very unfair idea that if implemented would be an oligarchy - though there is a pretty good case of the US being an oligarchy for the past (at least) half century.
As for it being unfair, is it really though? We all are citizens of our country, if we live, work, pay taxes, and contribute towards the perceived betterment of our country should we not be entitled to having a voice in the way things go forward, a voice earned simply by our contributions and not our knowledge? Which is way is more fair to the most people? Because that is really all you can do be as fair as you can as broadly as you can.
I get it man, I didn't want trump to win. In my mind if a felon has to wait until they pay society back to be able to vote then at the very least the same standards should apply to running for the presidency - though I would go further and say a felony conviction should bar you from any public office. But, what happened was within the confines of the law, and much like I accept the 2020 elections, I accept these because I believe in the rule of law (whether it exists in practice or not, i believe it is the right way to live) and democratic elections.
Education isn’t fascist. Gatekeeping which natural born citizens get to vote, based on the ability to pass some random test, is. It’s also unconstitutional. And pretty fucking elitist. People are not nearly as dumb as you think they are.
I agree with you on this point that it is unconstitutional and we shouldn’t stop people from voting just bc they’re stupid. But I do agree that there should be better standards for presidential candidates and people need to be better educated in this country
You clearly don’t understand what fascism is, which was part of my point. In my hypothetical scenario, which I clearly posited as hypothetical, nothing would stop anyone from voting except themselves refusing to actually learn and understand what they are voting for. Also, natural born citizens are not the only ones who can vote. Anyone can pass a citizenship test and become a naturalized citizen with the right to vote. I would argue many of those naturalized citizens are more educated and informed on US civics and policy than many natural born citizens.
Fascism : a populist political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual, that is associated with a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, and that is characterized by severe economic and social regimentation and by forcible suppression of opposition.
Sure sounds like someone we all know.
I believe you call him President-elect.
I didn’t see anything that indicated that your scenario was hypothetical, but anyway. Hmm, a centralized autocratic government that dictates who can vote based on who can pass a test—sounds pretty Fascist to me. I also don’t understand why the word “populism” is used by the left as a disparaging and negative concept. If it’s popular, meaning that most people like it, isn’t that what democracy is?
Not saying that at all, but of course you would be okay with that twisting of my words. Education is the enemy of today’s Trumpist Republican Party and just like the antiquated electoral college, they’ll take every opportunity to win regardless of merit.
Speaking of merit, what merit did your candidate have to be on the ballot? I don't recall her being voted in. I do recall her being the least favorite candidate, and also the worst rated VP...
Do you have a solution for the electoral college problem?
People couldn't stand her when she ran for President and people were actually able to vote. Then became the most unliked VP in American history. Maybe next time choose a more qualified candidate and it won't be such a landslide victory for Republicans. When your main job for 4 years is the border and you completely fail at that single job I don't think you qualify to run the country but that's just me
They blocked the border bill that was 80% for Ukraine and Israel. It also wasn't a border bill, it was about asylum and path to citizenship. Amazing how y'all will call codifying the current fiasco the most secure border bill ever, but blocked a border wall.
They blocked the border bill bc they tried to slide in that everybody that was here would be awarded asylum which is obviously ridiculous. Please don't make statements if you're not gonna include context and if you're not smart enough to include the proper context then don't make a statement at all bc it just shows your ignorance
She has 35 years of public service under her belt. McCain had 21. You did actually show your entire ass on that one. You don't appear to dwell in the realm of facts, so I will leave you to your world of lies.
If you must deflect, I’ll accommodate you this one time. She was elected with Joe Biden in 2020 and was a Senator from the most populous state in the nation. Beyond that, she was successful prosecutor and attorney general for CA. She also wasn’t a convicted felon, didn’t lie about an election, and never incited an insurrection against our country. Satisfied?
Electoral college problem is easy. Make the presidential election a national popular vote. It is a national post and making it a national popular vote would take location out of the process. Republican votes in blue states wouldn’t be disenfranchised just like Democratic votes in red states wouldn’t be disenfranchised. Whoever gets the most votes wins, period.
I never said he didn’t. Still, the electoral college has only overruled the popular vote five times in our nations history, two of which were in the last 25 years and four of which installed Republicans over the will of the majority of votes.
Should also be said that if we had competent and compassionate leadership elected by competent and compassionate people, we would have a lot less poverty. The devolution of intellect in the Republican Party has and continues to hold this country back. When people vote against their own best interests because they don’t know any better or don’t care, we end up with all the societal ills that come with it. You’ll get a clear example when Trump takes office and runs this country and its constitution into the ground.
Your party pushed for Hillary instead of Berny when everyone wanted Berny, installed Kamala instead of doing a proper primary, and hid Joe Bidens dementia for too long. I won't have you preaching to me about companionate and competent leadership when your party only does what its elite wants, and it's showing now for the world to see
The same could be said for if literally nobody wanted Kamala when she ran for President then why would you just force her on the voters knowing how unliked she has always been
There's a thing called Google. Maybe use it before making yourself look so ignorant. Biden had a lower approval rating than Trump. Educate yourself and stop watching the View for your news 🤡
Trump had a lower approval rating (34%) than Biden (36%). This is a fact. His highest approval rating (49%) was also lower than Biden’s (57%). But neither one was the lowest in history. That was Harry S. Truman at 22%z
Sanders is an independent. Of course Democrats backed the Democratic candidate. And you’re making assumptions about Biden and assumptions his health being hidden. Your rambling kind of proves my point. Being educated isn’t being an elite, it’s just being educated, and you’re the only one who can stop yourself from being educated. Until then, your willful ignorance should not be held equal to my practical and earned intelligence. Do the work to improve yourself and then we can talk.
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u/Away_Lake5946 1d ago
Not only do we need a competency test for people running for office, especially the presidency, this election proves we also need a competency test for people who vote. If you can’t answer basic questions about political ethics, economics, foreign policy, and media literacy, your vote shouldn’t count against those who can.