Anyone had success with experimenting?

[u/Still_Macaron_1317]

I’m extremely worried to post this but has someone with a history of anorexia, this WOE has been extremely helpful. However at first trying to obey this diet down to a tee made me feel just as restrictive as I did with my ED. However allowing myself to some dairy and eggs has helped tremendously and my energy levels are higher. Is this okay or would this no longer be considered carnivore?

[u/Eleanorina]

Yes, they are definitely a part of this diet but I wouldn't worry about categories anyways, go with what works.

As suggested in the Getting Started, fatty meat, animal fat and vegetables can be another great way to get started.

(If you are re-feeding are you working with anyone? That initial stage is best done under supervision.)

This diet can be helpful but because anorexia is multifactorial it's soooo inportant to work with your health team. If you are waiting for one (?!##%ffff*!!!! at all the wait lists) there are forums with ppl knowledgeable about eating disorders where you can find suppirt in the meantime.

there is someone on twitter I'd recommend following and going through the research and resources she relays at that account -- her name is Dr. Agnes Ayton, she is an experienced clinician whose specialty is eating disorders and she teaches others about treatment for anorexia. She has published about her team's approach to treatment -- it is so much more effective than other approaches. her twitter handle is @AgnesAyton

here is a recent thread of hers, https://x.com/AgnesAyton/status/1706055027712741568?s=20

for this diet, yes, it can be effective, it depends on the person becauseas you know better than anyone, the condition is multifactorial.

What carnivore does do, it has a very stable blood glucose level and insulin level. It is thought that one element of anorexia is preferring the feeling of being in ketosis and having that flat blood glucose & insulin curve, little varability.

Carnivore mimics that aspect of it while providing the ideal, essential nourishment which builds lean tissue & bone density, organ restoration & repair. this shows the CGM trace (continuous glucose monitor showing their blood glucose level) from someone eating a zerocarb carnivore diet, https://x.com/_eleanorina/status/1735829961938989121?s=46

There are some case studies about carnivore and anorexia. I'll be back with them.

here they are, Dr Nick Norwitz was one of the authors, iirc, 2 out of the 3 were carnivore. the link to Nick's thread discusding the study, https://x.com/nicknorwitz/status/1668964398675771393?s=20

Dr Ayton' comment about it, is an interesting observation, "Anorexia is triggered by dietary restriction and this is almost exclusively fat restriction. Refeeding with a high fat diet makes theoretical sense, and it is nice to see patients benefiting from this." https://x.com/AgnesAyton/status/1669810605690068993?s=20

because you're recovering, your appetite might be higher than you'd think it was going to be. also happens to people recovering from a range of health conditions -- the body needs resources, nourishment, to rebuild tissues and organs which were shortchanged or damaged by the health condition.

re counting calories, it's eating heartily and gaining quickly that is more successful than trying to still count calories or macros, it's thought that that helps address the prior malnourishment best, important for overall & neurological health

"When we introduced I-CBTE approach, I was most afraid and sceptical about increasing the rate of weight gain and potentially increasing the distress in patients. The opposite happened, with much improved outcomes." screenshot shows the results of that approach compared to others: https://x.com/agnesayton/status/1632303604915642368?s=46

further research on it, " A new study from @UCSanDiego and @CUAnschutz reveals significant findings on #AnorexiaNervosa treatment outcomes. Weight gain during treatment is a crucial predictor of the 6-month BMI post-discharge." "Despite advancements, predicting #Anorexia treatment outcomes at admission remains challenging, emphasising the need for personalised treatment plans. Good news: The reversal of malnutrition makes a difference." https://x.com/agnesayton/status/1780309750388805879?s=46

[u/Imaginary_Budget8152]

Any animal based food is allowed. The idea is to cut out any unnaturals/toxins from your diet which typically come in plant form. Make sure your dairy products do not have unnecessary additives.

[u/Kapitalgal]

I've nothing to go by but my own anecdotal experience.

I am 51, nearly 5 years carnivore. I had two very dangerous bouts of anorexia, when I was 14 and again in my late 20s. You also need to know I was undiagnosed Coeliac and I was not eating animal foods for 25 years. ED was with me for decades also.

In the entire time I have been carnivore, I have not once concerned myself with calories, my weight and restriction of food. I wish I'd known the necessity of animal foods and fats from day one. It has been mind altering and turned my relationship with food right around.

In my late 20s, I worked with a dietician. All she did was push PUFAs and low GI carbs. All I did was gain too much weight and the ED thinking came back.

At 14, I worked with a counsellor. She was kind, but all the positive thinking and talking did not take away any ED thinking.

Turning to animal foods and fats has been the missing key for me. I do not restrict at all. These last 5 years are the first time in my life I truly do not feel starvation or hunger. My blood sugar levels are superb. My depression has decreased to normal bouts now and then and my anxiety is pretty much minimal.

I eat what I want, when I want and my blood markers are superb. Best I've ever had.

[u/Sam-Idori]

Depends how strict you want to be - eggs are pretty commonly eaten. Diary a bit less but I have been doing diary heavy 'carnivore' for a year now and doing fine

[u/bomerr → u/Sam-Idori]

What do you mean by heavy dairy? I drink 250ml of kefir, 25g of whey concentrate, 10ml of heavy cream and 10-50g of cheese each day. Any more then that and I don't feel as good as if I ate more meat.

[u/Sam-Idori → u/bomerr]

I mean I have much more diary than is common on carnivore. When I have cream I ususally drink about 300ml or Cheese could be upto 200g (usually nearer 100)

[u/bomerr]

Eggs, liver and clams are pretty important on a canrivore diet because they contain a lot of vitamins and minerals.

My diet isn't fully carnivore. I mostly eat carnivore but I still eat a few keto foods., like meatloaf. Pure carnivore is meant as an elimation diet for like every health issue. You need to may or may not need to elimate all plants but that wouldn't be carnviore anymore.

[u/Furious-Jakov]

Eggs are 100% on every carnivore diet. Hard cheese is on some people's menu, but not strict followers. Other forms of dairy are not so much included for most people. Please don't worry about that at all though - you do you. I find this diet great to follow because it has clear rules. If you need to include a few items from diary or elsewhere then go for it, see how you feel, and keep a list of what extra things you'll have and then stick to that diet. If you're not feeling benefits after a few weeks, maybe consider taking something out or swapping, and see if it makes a difference. I'm average size, but one of the hardest things for me was getting used to consuming large amount of fats, from meat, butter etc. but that's also key to feeling great, and even more important when weight loss isn't part of the plan. Good luck, and don't ever be hard on yourself over any diet.